Sleep..

RE: Sleep.. (twistedlink)

Mon, 14 Jul 2008 00:05:28 GMT

hmm twisted are you a scientist or something?

student of it.

For a more scientific post now, so i didnt seem like a ranting idiot to the people who think sleeping during the day is the worst thing ever.

1.Yes melatonin is inhibited by light, this however does not as i said make it an end all situation
2.Photoperiodicity was touched somewhat earlier, i think optimumhealth was saying this as seasons change animals ready themselves for sex/birth etc etc, where melatonin is involved.

In any biological system, there is usually always more than 1 pathway...hell theres usually always more than 2 come to think of it.

Also, Humans are not a part of this, and it has been mostly suggested that it may play a role in our night/day cycle.

The italics are from a source, not my words.

Im trying to get hold of a journal thats testing melatonin, the unfortunate thing is i cant find the methods they used, because if i can see the methods i can see how good theyve controlled the extraneous variables, however the decent sources i found on melatonin (mainly oxford uni books and a highly approved US biology book) seems to only play melatonin as 1 player, not all.

Some vertebrates are controlled by light, my fish rarely sleep if i keep the light on, and do when the lights off, however they do sometimes not sleep even with the light off, however fish are very very old chordata phylums...and were chordatas...thats as close related we are...the phylum stage, so...lol...

The closest ones are mammals, i would go and get a list of the closer related ones but theres little point, weve all seen mammals, especially orangootangs, chimpanzees etc etc, and we all know in the zoo weve seen them snoozing under the sunlight.

RE: Sleep.. (Tylah827)

Sun, 13 Jul 2008 20:08:44 GMT

You guys may be over analyzing this. The great thing about the human body is its ability to adapt to its surroundings, what would life be like if it couldn't? It'd be short. So you give it some time and you will be fine going to bed at 3AM but if something like school or whatever is around the corner then I would suggest planning your schedule around that. I personally like waking up around 8 or 9 in the morning. I feel more awake, alert, and like I can get more done. But that's just me...

RE: Sleep.. (Yet)

Sun, 13 Jul 2008 19:37:10 GMT

ORIGINAL: packers4

hmm twisted are you a scientist or something?

He's a fxcking Brit, all he does is clutter the world with crumpets and cavier, and mopeds.

GTFO you giant puff, before I give your mum a jippy tummy.

RE: Sleep.. (packers4)

Sun, 13 Jul 2008 15:09:11 GMT

hmm twisted are you a scientist or something?

RE: Sleep.. (RollingStone)

Sun, 13 Jul 2008 14:03:26 GMT

I love him too.

RE: Sleep.. (Wyrms)

Sun, 13 Jul 2008 07:58:59 GMT

ORIGINAL: twistedlink

ORIGINAL: Creation

When the sun goes down your body quits producing Serotonin and starts producing melatonin aka the sleep hormone.

Therefore sleeping not at night is bad for your body and it has been proven to age you faster.

...And without this sleep hormone you cant sleep?

Without this sleep hormone EVERYTHING is ruined?

I think youll find after around 16 hours the body naturally (and the brain) gets tired, and releases more hormones i could name if i wanted to be all pedantic and patronising which do a great deal more than melatonin.

The sheer idea of the body or mind being controlled via a positive or negative feedback from UN PRECISELY VON hormone is ****ing laughable, stop watching shows that dumb down the science so the general dumbass public can understand, and pick up a book designed for a degree or higher, read, and then post, until then, dont.

P.S. Im not disputing sleeping at night and day is EXACTLY the same, there is a difference through melatonin levels yes, but not to any form of degree that would actually cause a problem.

Has anyone else noticed that during the 1900 to 1970 science was used to fix problems, however nowadays its become popular to use science as a scare tactic and to make problems

"Oh did you read this article, we cant eat that anymore"
"Oh my god did you read that article, we cant sleep at day anymore"
"Oh my god, were killing the planet, it cant be the thing millions times bigger than our planet thats on fire at stupid degrees celcius thats heated us up"
"Oh my god, im going to get cancer if i have sex (NOT A ****ING JOKE, THEY HAVE "PROVED" THIS)

Just dont take everything you read seriously, even in journals that are respected.

funding and job opportunities come from how the media react, no scientist is going to get a massive pay-check if they give no face to there company or university they work with.

If there name becomes published with the company and stuff, imagine the funding theyl have, especially if they make it a PROBLEM, because problems need to be SOLVED, and therein is where the funding comes from, by "fixing" this problem.

I like you.

RE: Sleep.. (twistedlink)

Sun, 13 Jul 2008 06:32:52 GMT

ORIGINAL: Creation

When the sun goes down your body quits producing Serotonin and starts producing melatonin aka the sleep hormone.

Therefore sleeping not at night is bad for your body and it has been proven to age you faster.

...And without this sleep hormone you cant sleep?

Without this sleep hormone EVERYTHING is ruined?

I think youll find after around 16 hours the body naturally (and the brain) gets tired, and releases more hormones i could name if i wanted to be all pedantic and patronising which do a great deal more than melatonin.

The sheer idea of the body or mind being controlled via a positive or negative feedback from UN PRECISELY VON hormone is ****ing laughable, stop watching shows that dumb down the science so the general dumbass public can understand, and pick up a book designed for a degree or higher, read, and then post, until then, dont.

P.S. Im not disputing sleeping at night and day is EXACTLY the same, there is a difference through melatonin levels yes, but not to any form of degree that would actually cause a problem.

Has anyone else noticed that during the 1900 to 1970 science was used to fix problems, however nowadays its become popular to use science as a scare tactic and to make problems

"Oh did you read this article, we cant eat that anymore"
"Oh my god did you read that article, we cant sleep at day anymore"
"Oh my god, were killing the planet, it cant be the thing millions times bigger than our planet thats on fire at stupid degrees celcius thats heated us up"
"Oh my god, im going to get cancer if i have sex (NOT A ****ING JOKE, THEY HAVE "PROVED" THIS)

Just dont take everything you read seriously, even in journals that are respected.

funding and job opportunities come from how the media react, no scientist is going to get a massive pay-check if they give no face to there company or university they work with.

If there name becomes published with the company and stuff, imagine the funding theyl have, especially if they make it a PROBLEM, because problems need to be SOLVED, and therein is where the funding comes from, by "fixing" this problem.

RE: Sleep.. (twistedlink)

Sun, 13 Jul 2008 06:19:37 GMT

what?

GH is at its most during 10pm and 2 am?

I didnt know our bodies knew the exact time, nor did i know that its thermoregulation with the hypothalamus was so ****ing awesome it could tell seasons apart and know that summer is light at 10pm and dark in winter at 10pm

Nor did i know our bodies also know what hemisphere we live on so as to note these other differences also.

Amazing "science"

Okay heres the deal

If wetdawg isnt allowed to state his personal experiences of doing graveyard shifts and hes fine (in another thread)

Then no one else is allowed to say "blah blah i sleep properly and i always have energy blah blah"

Its hypocritical, youre doing the same, and youre not proving any point.

Heres the deal, your body after around 12-16 hours NEEDS sleep, so it enters certain biochemical stages in which aids sleep, and repair.
It doesnt matter what time of the day it is, after 12-16 hours, your body is releasing the damn stuff.

HOWEVER there are certain reactions that occur which are light dependant.

...Be very careful of "light dependant" science.

Il have you know a "light independant" cycle in photosynthesis in plants is light dependant, its just stupidly named, and if anyone doesnt believe me il give you a thorough rant on it with sources an' all.

What im trying to point out is while some things are based on light (such as melatoning *spits*)

this doesnt mean its an all end all situation.

Does anyone here really think there body while asleep is actually going to metaphorically go

"well, lights beaming down on me, cant do ****"

if you do, please take a step to the left, and enter the door, you have failed the sentient being test, im sorry, retakes can be done next year.

No, we dont have full optimal prime recovering during the day, then again, we dont have prime recovering during the night when we fill ourselves with alcohol, when we fill ourselves with unhealthy fats, when we breathe in all the mercury and **** in the air, when we do loads of bad fun habits.

Ive said it before, and i will say it again, the amount of difference in sleeping at night or day is like being 5'8.1" or 5'8.2"

While this isnt the best of science experiments, my sister did have 13 hamsters, and as a safety precuation, we leave some lights on for burglars to not want to go near our house.

Them hamsters rarely saw night, and theyre nocturnal creatures.

They all lived past 4, some 5 years old.

The average age of a hamster is 2.5 years.

They were all healthy, and were fine as hamsters go.

RE: Sleep.. (SBCdaniel007)

Wed, 09 Jul 2008 12:09:38 GMT

but i think you guys forgot about people who work at night shifts and go to sleep during day lift. AKA "owl ppl", ppl like security gaurd, bartenders, waitresses they go to sleep while we are outside dilligently. they seem to be perfectly fine.

RE: Sleep.. (Yet)

Wed, 02 Jul 2008 19:32:31 GMT

Everything in moderation as far as the sun is concerned.

As far as sleep cycles go, when you're born you're programmed to sleep when the sun is down and wake when the sun is up. You're not fully developed though at birth which is why many infants wake up in the middle of the night.

This can be changed, as can most of our basic instincts.

However, if you give yourself time, for example, a year with no work or anything to be awake for, stay up as late as you want and when you're tired go to bed, and wake up when you wake up, your body will start waking you earlier and earlier so you sleep earlier and earlier.

As far as growth goes, 8 hours is 8 hours.

RE: Sleep.. (Soccerking3000)

Tue, 01 Jul 2008 15:43:01 GMT

ORIGINAL: Wetdawg
I think he's correct on that also. Sun, Drinking heavy, Smoking all makes you age quick. I can show you several people younger than I (40-46) That look way older than me. You may not see it know, but wait til your 40ish.
The sun does give you Vita-D, but its not a daily "in the sun or you suffer" thing. Milk balances out vita-D or a supplement. I'm not completely in the dark, so to speak

WD

on that token then we should just give up food and drink protein and meal replacements, a natural way (ingesting milk isnt necessarily natural past being a child), will always be better than supplementation

RE: Sleep.. (Wetdawg)

Tue, 01 Jul 2008 15:15:05 GMT

As for the youthful appearance, thats opinion, although i dont doubt the sun ages your skin, it is also very important to get sunlight as it helps produce vitamin d as many other benefits

I think he's correct on that also. Sun, Drinking heavy, Smoking all makes you age quick. I can show you several people younger than I (40-46) That look way older than me. You may not see it know, but wait til your 40ish.
The sun does give you Vita-D, but its not a daily "in the sun or you suffer" thing. Milk balances out vita-D or a supplement. I'm not completely in the dark, so to speak

WD

RE: Sleep.. (Soccerking3000)

Tue, 01 Jul 2008 15:09:26 GMT

ORIGINAL: Wetdawg

ORIGINAL: Creation

When the sun goes down your body quits producing Serotonin and starts producing melatonin aka the sleep hormone.

Therefore sleeping not at night is bad for your body and it has been proven to age you faster.

Im on the same track as Deadlysuperstar on this one. The whole rythmn/clock thing is ok if im looking to get pregnant. Sleeping is another story. I work all night long without a hitch. I went to dayshift last year for 4 months, was always trying to nap at 10:30, then again at 3pm. Back on nights I don't even think of napping. When the sun comes up, I get tired. 6-7am I'm ready for sleep. I travel at night also, no one on the road and i'm wide awake. Of course I make sure to pack my grave soil in a ziplock if I am away from home more than one day.

WD

one can have a modified sleep schedule, for example i used to work from noon until 9pm and i owuld wake up at 8am everyday. My work scheduled changed and i now work at 5am until 1pm and for a month it was hell i was tired all the time came home from work and crashed ect ect. But soon after i found myself waking up without an alarm clock and feeling sleep automatically at 8pm (when i go to bed). So i think we are programmed to go to sleep when the sun goes down and wake up when the sun comes up but we have the ability to modify it if you have a strict schedule.

As for the youthful appearance, thats opinion, although i dont doubt the sun ages your skin, it is also very important to get sunlight as it helps produce vitamin d as many other benefits

RE: Sleep.. (Wetdawg)

Tue, 01 Jul 2008 14:44:29 GMT

ORIGINAL: Creation

When the sun goes down your body quits producing Serotonin and starts producing melatonin aka the sleep hormone.

Therefore sleeping not at night is bad for your body and it has been proven to age you faster.

Im on the same track as Deadlysuperstar on this one. The whole rythmn/clock thing is ok if im looking to get pregnant. Sleeping is another story. I work all night long without a hitch. I went to dayshift last year for 4 months, was always trying to nap at 10:30, then again at 3pm. Back on nights I don't even think of napping. When the sun comes up, I get tired. 6-7am I'm ready for sleep. I travel at night also, no one on the road and i'm wide awake. Of course I make sure to pack my grave soil in a ziplock if I am away from home more than one day.

WD

RE: Sleep.. (thehardway)

Tue, 01 Jul 2008 06:42:17 GMT

I really disagree, yet agree at the same time..

WHile yes we have evolved to ideally oppurate on farmers time, I don't think the is everbodies body clock.

I personally, when I allow my body to cue me for sleep (and I am pretty much a hermit, so this has nothing ot do with social obligations, or fun), want to go to sleep about 4 in the morning, wake up around 2 pm. My most productive hours are usually 6 pm - 2 am. Especially when it is summer and it is hot.

When I go on vacation, (from work), and remain home rather than traveling, my body slowly revets to this constant , or ideal (for me), even if i fight it, as going back to work becomes even more unpleasant.

I am 32 years old and this has been my pattern ever since I can remember. No sleep I get is better than when I sleep through the morning entirely, and start my day in the early afternoon.