ok...who thinks we need this

I like the idea of deleting/locking all ph/ds threads personally

 
 
*Bump*  No talk of PH/DS  No questions asked no answers.  If you lose posters screw it how many of these kids come back anyways?  When do you see them posting pictures of their results?   Not very often..
 
Most of the time because they don't know what they are doing with their training and diet so they just bloat up with 5 - 6lbs of water lie on the forum pretend they gained 10  and then once the cycle is over they lose it and they never come back to DB to post again.    Or you get a bunch of use to's on here or done that's.  I use to take this that and this and im Huge! "Prove it"   I have done that this and this and I have gained 1000 lbs !  "Prove it" 
 
The people who really progress on the forum "The ones that I made a subject about" were all accomplishing their goals through dieting and training.  I don't see too many people on that list who hang out in the suppliments forum all day long.

ORIGINAL: Marc David

Keep in mind that...

* moderators do an excellent job here without any pay.  Most of them don't even have a vested interest in promoting their own websites
* there's hundreds of posts a day and policing it is a communal job as well.  Not replying to such posts keeps them from staying at the top.  Reporting problem posts helps the mods and admins get to a problem quickly

And the #1 way to eliminate the problem?

Make DB a paid membership forum.

That would eliminate almost every single instance as the average age of the posters are under 18 and we both know that most people are unwilling to pay for a membership site.  Demographics prove that.

But DB is a free site.  Has been and always will be.

And such, we are bound to be plagued with such issues.  But if the majority of the community supports a natural bodybuilding stance, such posts will come and go quickly.

Point them to the existing FAQs in the Pro-Hormone section and let them read.  That's all anybody really can do.

I would not mind deleting every damn PH/DS thread that I see.. I hang out on this thing everyday anyways at work..  Honestly I really would delete/Lock every PH/DS subject and you don't have to pay me anything.

Incase you have not noticed these are what start a majority of the arguments around here anyways.

I like taking the drol by the sack loads.. What's in it ? Who knows I'm pretty sure it's roids, it makes my muscles bigger helps me to run faster and gives me dude boobs. I don't even need a girlfriend anymore. I take the bottle everywhere I go, I just keep it in my pants where my testicals use to be.

ORIGINAL: Jayman666

I like taking the drol by the sack loads.. What's in it ? Who knows I'm pretty sure it's roids, it makes my muscles bigger helps me to run faster and gives me dude boobs. I don't even need a girlfriend anymore. I take the bottle everywhere I go, I just keep it in my pants where my testicals use to be.

so...was this an attempt at humor?

"poena est vires in dissimulo"

Start
Height : 6'
Weight : 258lbs
Waist : 38"
Bicep : 16"
Neck : 20"

Now
Height : 6'
Weight : 200
Waist : 32"
Bicep : 17.25
Neck : 19"
BF% - 7.4%

 I'm pretty sure he was serious...

President of the Emancipation Detoxification. DBB's oldest forum group, punching baby seals since 2/12/08

Sounding good.  As long as (like Vaughn said) we go one way or the other with it.  I guess (even though they are legal) since they aren't allowed in competitions it'd be ok to not discuss them here.
 

I don't understand why people sign up for a forum that isn't about prohormones or anabolics and they feel the need to discuss them and educate everybody. 

 
It isn't about prohormones or anabolics...it's about everything (pretty much).  The name of the site is discussbodybuilding.com, not discussnaturalbodybuilding.com.... maybe that's why there's so many posts about them.  And some don't feel the need to start topics, but when someone posts about them, someone needs to step up and help... that's what forums are about.

ORIGINAL: toolman4052

Sounding good.  As long as (like Vaughn said) we go one way or the other with it.  I guess (even though they are legal) since they aren't allowed in competitions it'd be ok to not discuss them here.

I don't understand why people sign up for a forum that isn't about prohormones or anabolics and they feel the need to discuss them and educate everybody. 

It isn't about prohormones or anabolics...it's about everything (pretty much).  The name of the site is discussbodybuilding.com, not discussnaturalbodybuilding.com.... maybe that's why there's so many posts about them.  And some don't feel the need to start topics, but when someone posts about them, someone needs to step up and help... that's what forums are about.

 


S Drol, Havoc, Etc Etc.. Labelled as dietary supplements regardless of what they are.  I see no problem here.

Nolvadex--Prescription drug for breast cancer in Women. Probably not the best to give advice to People and Kids to take this.

All this " YOU NEED A SERM" talk...Yeah a Serm is the answer to everything. I used Novedex Xt and it worked great for me F CK a Serm 

The only advice I would give someone under 18 is, not to use such a substance (S drol) or whatver...I wouldn't figure they are taking it anyway so I might as well help them. Yeah have some young kid taking a damn SERM for breast cancer. Nice one.  Let them make there own mistake, giving out medical advice on hormones and estrogen isn't cool, kinda stupid really.

Nolvadex--Prescription drug for breast cancer in Women. Probably not the best to give advice to People and Kids to take this.

All this " YOU NEED A SERM" talk...Yeah a Serm is the answer to everything. I used Novedex Xt and it worked great for me F CK a Serm

Not to mention, it throws us right up against the legality wall again.

What's the point of discussing a legal pro-hormone if the PCT is dependent on items that require a prescription?  If you're going to break the law to obtain a SERM (not to mention the cholesterol meds you may end up needing after an oral cycle), why not dispense with all the liver risks of an oral and just go for the oil?

Vaughn i would still like to read your article i might make a suggestion go ahead and make your article somewhere else then pm those of us who really want to read it that way we can give more credible advise for people's question's just an idea

Check out my Video
http://youtube.com/watch?v=vlWZpChpCzY

Also check out my log
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_275052/mpage_1/key_/tm.htm#275052

Wow.  Simply WOW.

I've been doing a lot of reading during the past week, piecing together an understanding of AAS and Prohormones, trying to get to the simple facts about legality, and I came accross this article (and several others like it on the same site).  It simply boggles my mind that I made this exacty same conclusion two days ago in response to one of TL's posts.  Probably not news to those of you who have been advocating for a more reasoned and less hysterical review of the subject at hand, but bear with me -until now, I've been reluctantly swallowing the lay news media's unqualified misinformation wholesale.  This is a very compelling look at the fruits of Anabolic Steroid Control Act (U.S. law), and it opens up a whole field of philosophical debate.  Excerpted (the rest can be found here):

Reforming Our Anabolic Steroid Laws


The Anabolic Steroid Control Act has been a prescription for failure. Illegal use has continued unabated and the potential dangers associated with anabolic steroid use have been significantly increased because of the Act. Meanwhile, legitimate uses and vital research have been suppressed. While anti-steroid experts try to minimize the real life effects of the criminalization approach upon those apprehended for merely personal use, the effects of arrest and prosecution, even where a sentence of incarceration is averted, can be quite devastating. This is especially true since most adult steroid users lead otherwise responsible, law-abiding lives.


Steroid prohibitionists have met any challenges to the status quo with resistance, maintaining: "However imperfect our present systems might be, it would be a terrible mistake to consider legalizing performance-enhancing drugs... We cannot depend on athletes making judicious use of steroids during their athletic careers. From the earliest times, the pattern has always been one of excess. Alcohol regulation does not entirely prevent alcohol abuse by youngsters but it serves as a check that is in the best interests of society." The argument invites two responses. First, the observation about athletes themselves being incompetent to judiciously use steroids more persuasively supports the contrary position. Reforming the law to again allow doctors to be involved in the dosage regulation, administration, and health monitoring of athletes using anabolics would vastly reduce the patterns of "excess." Second, the analogy to alcohol is well taken in a way that must have been overlooked. Recognizing the failure of Prohibition, Congress changed our national laws regarding alcohol use from prohibition to restriction, permitting use by mature adults but banning sales to minors. Just as our society views alcohol and tobacco as requiring maturity for responsible use, so too should any relaxation of laws regarding anabolic hormones be reserved for adults only.


An alternate solution to the problem is sorely needed, and discourse must begin on the details of the reformation. Regulation as prescription drugs and removal of criminal penalties for adult personal use with a prescription would solve some of the problems created by the Control Act itself. Physicians would no longer fear being arrested for dispensing moderate amounts of anabolics to mature adults for cosmetic purposes. Steroid users would no longer be discouraged from continuous health monitoring. Responsible cosmetic users would no longer be imprisoned or transformed into criminals. Those suffering from AIDS or age-related infirmities would have greater access to needed medications. Funding for anabolic steroid research would certainly increase. There would be a major shifting of the steroid supply to favor legitimately produced, FDA regulated products. Clearly, the two greatest dangers in the use of anabolic steroids today - the use of tainted black market substances and the failure to be medically monitored and supervised - would be averted by this approach. Of course, anabolic steroids would be restricted to adults, and non-physicians caught trafficking in steroids, especially selling steroids to minors, would be subjected to stiff criminal sanctions. Organized sports bodies could continue to ban steroids for participating athletes, with more aggressive testing and punishments.


While there are obvious political hurdles standing in the way of such reformation, it is time for our laws to discard the unqualified view of anabolic steroids as "deadly drugs" for mature adults, based on the medical and scientific truth. The current scheme, with its unsupervised self-administration of potentially dangerous black market pharmaceuticals and the arrest and prosecution of mature adults seeking physique enhancement, is the wrong prescription indeed.

COPYRIGHT (c) 2005 by Rick Collins.

ORIGINAL: veggeep

Nolvadex--Prescription drug for breast cancer in Women. Probably not the best to give advice to People and Kids to take this.

All this " YOU NEED A SERM" talk...Yeah a Serm is the answer to everything. I used Novedex Xt and it worked great for me F CK a Serm

Not to mention, it throws us right up against the legality wall again.

What's the point of discussing a legal pro-hormone if the PCT is dependent on items that require a prescription?  If you're going to break the law to obtain a SERM (not to mention the cholesterol meds you may end up needing after an oral cycle), why not dispense with all the liver risks of an oral and just go for the oil?

like I've stated MANY times before, SERMS can be obtained legally and for very little money.


do more research.

"poena est vires in dissimulo"

Start
Height : 6'
Weight : 258lbs
Waist : 38"
Bicep : 16"
Neck : 20"

Now
Height : 6'
Weight : 200
Waist : 32"
Bicep : 17.25
Neck : 19"
BF% - 7.4%

i would also like to see a section to educate members about prohormones just for the knowledge.  I find it very annoying when some stupid 15 year old starts making posts about prohormone use, and they continue to do so even though this forum is supposed to be "PH and AAS Free."  Considering that many prohormones are still legal and advertised regularly, it makes since to have a guide to using them but DOES NOT condone the use of them.

Age: 18
Height: 5'7"
Body Weight: 180-185
BF %: 8 %
Incline Barbell: 195 x 8
Squat: 295 x 8, ass to ground
Shoulder Press: 175 x 8
Barbell Row: 195 x 8
Skullcrushers: 105 x 10
(All lifts are on 3rd set)

like I've stated MANY times before, SERMS can be obtained legally and for very little money.


do more research.

Pardon my exhasperation, but now I feel like we're going in circles.  Your PM to me specifically names one route by which to obtain SERMs "legally".  In truth, your advice was just another re-packaged explanation of a loophole through which to circumvent the prescription necessity.

Either way, at the end of the day, you end up in possession of a prescription medication without having been prescribed it.  How is that legal again?

I don't get why this is such a grey area for people advocating Nolvadex (or any legal-with-a-prescription med, for that matter).  If you have to jump through so many hoops to obtain this stuff, your claims of legality fall apart.  Period.  The law doesn't give two sh*ts about ONLY how you obtained the stuff.  The law encompasses procurement, possession, AND use.

If you have to make any reference to a substance that can't be bought over the counter at a local health food store without a prescription, then you are refering to DE FACTO clandestine activity.

Show me the LEGAL, OTC Estrogen blockers, and convince me they're as effective as the prescription variety.  Enough with the "just buy it from Canada and have it shipped on a full moon while reading Noam Chomsky" advice.  That is not legal -that's merely taking a less direct route to the same illegal end.

Marc laid down his statements, and i agree with them, all of them, i also agree mostly with veg here upon legal stances, actually scratch mostly, all.

ORIGINAL: veggeep

like I've stated MANY times before, SERMS can be obtained legally and for very little money.


do more research.

Pardon my exhasperation, but now I feel like we're going in circles.  Your PM to me specifically names one route by which to obtain SERMs "legally".  In truth, your advice was just another re-packaged explanation of a loophole through which to circumvent the prescription necessity.

Either way, at the end of the day, you end up in possession of a prescription medication without having been prescribed it.  How is that legal again?

I don't get why this is such a grey area for people advocating Nolvadex (or any legal-with-a-prescription med, for that matter).  If you have to jump through so many hoops to obtain this stuff, your claims of legality fall apart.  Period.  The law doesn't give two sh*ts about ONLY how you obtained the stuff.  The law encompasses procurement, possession, AND use.

If you have to make any reference to a substance that can't be bought over the counter at a local health food store without a prescription, then you are refering to DE FACTO clandestine activity.

Show me the LEGAL, OTC Estrogen blockers, and convince me they're as effective as the prescription variety.  Enough with the "just buy it from Canada and have it shipped on a full moon while reading Noam Chomsky" advice.  That is not legal -that's merely taking a less direct route to the same illegal end.

there are no OTC estrogen blockers that are as effective as the prescription variety, thus the seperation of OTC and prescription.


Obtaining Nolvadex/any SERM is completely Legal. If you DECIDE to use it for human consumption, thats your choice, however finding/purchasing/getting a serm shipped to your house is 100% LEGAL.

"poena est vires in dissimulo"

Start
Height : 6'
Weight : 258lbs
Waist : 38"
Bicep : 16"
Neck : 20"

Now
Height : 6'
Weight : 200
Waist : 32"
Bicep : 17.25
Neck : 19"
BF% - 7.4%