RE: The perfect supplements before/following exercise!!!
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RE: The perfect supplements before/following exercise!!! - 6/19/2006 2:28:26 PM
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danmirage
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Total cardio plus lifting time should not exceed 75 minutes..total lifting time should not exceed 45 minutes.
The before exercise info is fine.
Do not take anything but water between lifting and cardio...
Then:
5 g BCAAs directly following cardio or 0.1 g/lb whey directly following cardio.
quote:
During workout
0.4 g/kg carbs. You consume this spread over the entire exercise period.
A note about that...
IF you are cutting then this will protect muscle, but may inhibit your cutting...so test it on yourself.
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(in reply to TIHulk)
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RE: The perfect supplements before/following exercise!!! - 6/19/2006 2:48:44 PM
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TIHulk
Posts: 637
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quote:
ORIGINAL: danmirage
Total cardio plus lifting time should not exceed 75 minutes..total lifting time should not exceed 45 minutes.
The before exercise info is fine.
Do not take anything but water between lifting and cardio...
Then:
5 g BCAAs directly following cardio or 0.1 g/lb whey directly following cardio.
quote:
During workout
0.4 g/kg carbs. You consume this spread over the entire exercise period.
A note about that...
IF you are cutting then this will protect muscle, but may inhibit your cutting...so test it on yourself.
Hey, thanks for replying!...
Is there a reason for not exceeding 75 mins... I do 45 mins of weightlifting (not including warming up and stretching) and another 45 mins of walking fast on the treadmill... Should I drop the cardio down to 30 mins?
Why not drink whey after weightlifting but only after cardio?
In your opinion for a 250 lb male what should be the adequate amount of whey protein to intake BEFORE (also how long before) weightlifting and AFTER cardio (also how long after) as you recommended?
Thanks!... I sincerely appreciate it!!! :)
(in reply to danmirage)
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RE: The perfect supplements before/following exercise!!! - 6/19/2006 3:09:50 PM
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danmirage
Posts: 6023
Joined: 11/20/2005
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I assume the discussion is for cutting.
quote:
Is there a reason for not exceeding 75 mins
You start the muscle wasting cycle...however if you are preparing for a competition, then you know that you will lose some muscle to get to the level of leanness you need to compete...in that case, exceeding this is needed to cut for a competition and is an exception.
The pre workout recommendations are fine...
quote:
Why not drink whey after weightlifting but only after cardio?
It says:
30 min. before exercise
0.2 g/lb whey
Directly before exercise
5 g BCAAs or 15 g EAAs (When you use EAAs you can leave the
pre-exercise whey away)
When exercise is not immediatly followed by cardio:
Immediately following exercise
5 g BCAAs or 15 g EAAs
(When you can not use BCAAs/Essential Amino Acids, take 0.1 g/lb whey post workout.)
That would mean
250 x .2 = 50 grams pure whey protein pre workout
250 x .1 = 25 grams pure whey protein post exercise
I use the BCAA myself...since that is what the body is going to extract from the protein and BCAA gets into the system faster.
Pre w/o BCAA acts to spare muscle...
I follow this with my normal meal about 45-60 minutes later
_____________________________
My journal:
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_158705/mpage_2/tm.htm
Primers:
Gaining Mass
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_111173/mpage_1/tm.htm
Losing Fat
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_111175/mpage_1/tm.htm
(in reply to TIHulk)
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RE: The perfect supplements before/following exercise!!! - 6/19/2006 3:41:15 PM
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TIHulk
Posts: 637
Status: offline
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What's a good EAA???
Thanks! :)
< Message edited by TIHulk -- 6/19/2006 3:47:53 PM >
(in reply to danmirage)
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RE: The perfect supplements before/following exercise!!! - 6/19/2006 5:43:10 PM
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TIHulk
Posts: 637
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quote:
ORIGINAL: danmirage
I assume the discussion is for cutting.
quote:
Is there a reason for not exceeding 75 mins
You start the muscle wasting cycle...however if you are preparing for a competition, then you know that you will lose some muscle to get to the level of leanness you need to compete...in that case, exceeding this is needed to cut for a competition and is an exception.
The pre workout recommendations are fine...
quote:
Why not drink whey after weightlifting but only after cardio?
It says:
30 min. before exercise
0.2 g/lb whey
Directly before exercise
5 g BCAAs or 15 g EAAs (When you use EAAs you can leave the
pre-exercise whey away)
When exercise is not immediatly followed by cardio:
Immediately following exercise
5 g BCAAs or 15 g EAAs
(When you can not use BCAAs/Essential Amino Acids, take 0.1 g/lb whey post workout.)
That would mean
250 x .2 = 50 grams pure whey protein pre workout
250 x .1 = 25 grams pure whey protein post exercise
I use the BCAA myself...since that is what the body is going to extract from the protein and BCAA gets into the system faster.
Pre w/o BCAA acts to spare muscle...
I follow this with my normal meal about 45-60 minutes later
Why not drink the whey right before the weightlifting instead of 30 mins before??? (Absorbtion?)
75 grams of protein within less than a 2 hour period!!! That seems like a lot!!! That’s about 1/3rd of my total protein consumption for the whole day! (~250gs) Should I up my protein intake to 300-350grams???
By intaking 50 grams of protein before the weightlifting will I still lose fat??? Or will the protein get used up as fuel instead of body fat???
I stop eating about 3 hours before I go to sleep... Do you recommend taking a whey protein shake before I go to sleep??? (30 mins before or so??? How many grams???) Or should I just stick with my last meal which is 3-4 hrs before I go to sleep!?
Thanks! :)
< Message edited by TIHulk -- 6/19/2006 6:12:19 PM >
(in reply to danmirage)
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RE: The perfect supplements before/following exercise!!! - 6/19/2006 5:59:00 PM
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jjrn
Posts: 7
Joined: 5/1/2006
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Can anyone tell me what kind of carbs I should be taking during my workout? I am currently cutting and taking protein shakes before and after workouts, with only water during.
_____________________________
Age: 33
Height: 5'7"
Starting weight/body fat- 202lbs/30+%???
Current weight/body fat- 175lbs/24%
(in reply to TIHulk)
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RE: The perfect supplements before/following exercise!!! - 6/19/2006 7:48:46 PM
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danmirage
Posts: 6023
Joined: 11/20/2005
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quote:
Can anyone tell me what kind of carbs I should be taking during my workout?
If You are cutting for competition, so you SHOULD NOT use carbs this way. Otherwise a simple carb drink is fine.
quote:
Why not drink the whey right before the weightlifting instead of 30 mins before??? (Absorbtion?)
Correct. Availability.
quote:
By intaking 50 grams of protein before the weightlifting will I still lose fat??? Or will the protein get used up as fuel instead of body fat???
There is only 1 energy source for anaerobic movement (lifting) that is glucose. Your body has 2 sources for glucose...glycogen stored in muscles and the liver OR protein either in the bloodstream or in muscle.
The protein is to spare muscle.
Aerobic movement has 2 options for energy...glucose or fat. After lifting, the glucose is mostly used up. If you keep the post lifting cardio intensity moderate...you are primarily tapping the fat source...assuming your body is glucagon dominant.
quote:
I stop eating about 3 hours before I go to sleep... Do you recommend taking a whey protein shake before I go to sleep??? (30 mins before or so??? How many grams???) Or should I just stick with my last meal which is 3-4 hrs before I go to sleep!?
Have a meal every 3 hours that you are awake. Unprocessed food is thermic, meaning it increases your metabolism...the shake will not. The protein shake will only spare muscle and could cause a rise in GH while you sleep (a good thing)....both of which a whole food protein and veggie meal would accomplish in addition to the thermic effect.
quote:
75 grams of protein within less than a 2 hour period!!!
That 2 hour period is the time in which your body uses energy at a very high rate, this is to protect muscle from being broken down to be used for that energy...also if you train excessively and cause cortisol release...you lock in fat and tear down muscle for energy...instead just use the protein. BCAA is also effective.
BCAA Powder <---the one I use...I prefer the powder over the capsule because of the faster absorption and the cost.
quote:
That seems like a lot!!! That’s about 1/3rd of my total protein consumption for the whole day! (~250gs) Should I up my protein intake to 300-350grams???
Assuming you are cutting..meaning you are starting to manipulate nutrient intake...your protein intake should be going up anyway...
_____________________________
My journal:
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_158705/mpage_2/tm.htm
Primers:
Gaining Mass
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_111173/mpage_1/tm.htm
Losing Fat
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_111175/mpage_1/tm.htm
(in reply to jjrn)
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RE: The perfect supplements before/following exercise!!! - 6/19/2006 8:35:02 PM
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TIHulk
Posts: 637
Status: offline
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To clarify…
quote:
Correct. Availability.
So you recommend taking the whey ~30 min before and not immediately before???
quote:
Have a meal every 3 hours that you are awake. Unprocessed food is thermic, meaning it increases your metabolism...the shake will not. The protein shake will only spare muscle and could cause a rise in GH while you sleep (a good thing)....both of which a whole food protein and veggie meal would accomplish in addition to the thermic effect.
So how long before i go to sleep should I ingest my last meal? (Right before or a couple hours before?) What should the last meal consist of? (Protein, Starchy Carbs, Fibrous Carbs, Fats???)
quote:
Assuming you are cutting..meaning you are starting to manipulate nutrient intake...your protein intake should be going up anyway...
How much should it go up considering I only eat two starchy carbs in a meal a day - half a cup of old fashion oatmeal (not the quick kind which has a slightly higher GI=66) for the first and second meals? (I also carb up every 3-4 days…) The next four meals only consist of Fibrous Carbs, protein and fat and no starchy carbs!
Thanks in advance for your advice… Once again it is highly appreciated! :)
< Message edited by TIHulk -- 6/19/2006 8:36:21 PM >
(in reply to danmirage)
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RE: The perfect supplements before/following exercise!!! - 6/19/2006 8:44:26 PM
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danmirage
Posts: 6023
Joined: 11/20/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
So you recommend taking the whey ~30 min before and not immediately before???
That is correct, and I recommend you drink water for the 30 minutes leading in.
quote:
So how long before i go to sleep should I ingest my last meal?
Really, it can be just before you retire if tyhat is how the timing works. Some people need an hour after eating before they can get to sleep...Don't worry about how long between the meal and bed...think about eating every 3 hours you are awake.
If you ate at 7 and it is 10 and you are still up...EAT.
If you are cutting I recommend a whole food protein and veggie meal with a whole food carb if you are eating carbs, ...
If you are in the final cut, pre-contest/shoot/whatever...then naturally only eat from the foods you are including in your diet at the time.
quote:
The next four meals only consist of Fibrous Carbs, protein and fat and no starchy carbs!
Oh..that is your answer!
Sounds like you are doing ok on the meals!
_____________________________
My journal:
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_158705/mpage_2/tm.htm
Primers:
Gaining Mass
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_111173/mpage_1/tm.htm
Losing Fat
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_111175/mpage_1/tm.htm
(in reply to TIHulk)
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RE: The perfect supplements before/following exercise!!! - 6/19/2006 9:07:12 PM
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TIHulk
Posts: 637
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: danmirage
If you are cutting I recommend a whole food protein
Do you also recommend whole food protein for the (30 min before) pre-workout & (immediately after) post-workout meals???... Or would a whey protein shake be better and then the rest of the day whole food protein???
(in reply to danmirage)
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RE: The perfect supplements before/following exercise!!! - 6/19/2006 9:55:57 PM
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TIHulk
Posts: 637
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: danmirage
Yuo can eat a complete meal 1 hour before and take BCAAs immediatly before...or do the whey protein 30 minutes and the BCAA immediatly...or just the protein 30 minutes before or just the complete meal 1 hour before...
These are concepts for you to start to think into.
Try to understand the IDEA of getting sufficient protein before the workout and some BCAAs (also found in pure whey) after your training.
Then about 30-60 minutes later getting a meal.
I got all my questions answered with your assistance!!!
Thanks for your time and kind help once again!... It won't be forgotten!!! :)
(in reply to danmirage)
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RE: The perfect supplements before/following exercise!!! - 7/5/2006 1:05:22 PM
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Techsan
Posts: 105
Joined: 5/28/2006
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This thread talks about BCAAs like crazy, but what the heck is a BCAA and what kinds of natural foods can I get them in?
< Message edited by Techsan -- 7/5/2006 1:06:54 PM >
(in reply to TIHulk)
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RE: The perfect supplements before/following exercise!!! - 7/5/2006 2:50:58 PM
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danmirage
Posts: 6023
Joined: 11/20/2005
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They are Branched Chain Amino Acids.
Isoleucine, Leucine and Valine.
They are in almost all foods.
HOWEVER
When taken alone in BCAA form they do not go through the digestive process and instead pass into the blood stream. When the body goes to catabolize muscle during a workout...it is likely to be BCAAs that it is going after...as these can be converted into glycogen...
So taking them pre workout or Pre Stand-Alone Cardio can have a muscle sparing effect.
Taking them post exercise can also spare muscle adn also speed the return to an anabolic state.
You don't need them...they are like an insurance policy when bulking, and when cutting they are more significant.
Taken .1 g per pound of pure whey 30 minutes prior to exercise or eating a complete meal 45-60 minutes prior would effectively cover your bases.
BCAA at 1/4 teaspoon per 35 pounds of bodyweight, Or 5g (1 rounded teaspoon)...before adn after exercise.
_____________________________
My journal:
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_158705/mpage_2/tm.htm
Primers:
Gaining Mass
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_111173/mpage_1/tm.htm
Losing Fat
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_111175/mpage_1/tm.htm
(in reply to Techsan)
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