Shoulder Exercises

Hey everyone, I've been browsing the forum for a few weeks now and have even started using MAX-OT to some extent. I was wondering what the "best" or most popular shoulder exercises are. Currently I've been using a military style press machine because I tweaked my left shoulder somehow and have been trying to take it easy to get back into the game. Lots of people have recommended doing military presses with dumbells but I don't always have a workout partner, which makes going heavy very difficult. Thanks in advance-


Also wanted to say this site has been very helpful for me so far, thanks a lot!

There's quite alot of different shoulder exercises.......don't eliminate the shoulder press though, as it is a staple shoulder movement.
With shoulder work, one must ensure that all heads of the deltoid are being hit. That means using movements that will target the front, back and middle delts. This all can't be done in one exercise/movement.
Medial delt: lateral raise,s shrugs (behind the back and in front of) and so on
Anterior delt: forward raises, pushups.....
Posterior delt: bent over lateral raises.......
...just to name a few.

Why bother with shoulder exercises? If you are doing a complete chest, back and leg routine, your shoulders will get a great workout and will grow.
It is the same with bicep and tricep workouts. I see people spending a lot of time with those muscles and for me, it is not worth it. After a complete chest workout, i will do one excercise for tri's. Thats all that is needed since they are blasted from doing chest. Same with Bi's, after doing back, i do 1 bicep exercise. It works great for me. If you concentrait on the bigger muscles, the smaller ones will follow.

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I'd argue but I'd have no ground to stand on. I do all muscle groups but shoulders as well. They are plenty sore after my chest and back workouts. So I know I'm stimulating them.

I'm not shabby when it comes to shoulders either.

However, it's still a major muscle group (legs, chest, back, arms, shoulders)

I do believe that if you concentrate on the bigger muscles with compound heavy movements the smaller ones will follow. But I don't think you will achieve the maximum amount of potential by not focusing in on what most would consider to be a major muscle group.

Hey.. I'm guilty as well. I'm just playing devil's advocate until TreeTrunks or Twin Peak make an appearance.

Marc C. David
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I have to disagree... working out your shoulders is important. Sure, doing your chest and back will hit your shoulders... but they will also hit your arms as well... so would you stop working out your arms? Not working out your shoulders will likely lead to injuries in future years of lifting. As you increase weight for chest and back your shoulders will not be built enough to accommodate the extra weight.

If there were a muscle that could be excluded from a workout it's the bicep. That is the most least used muscle on our body yet many of us hit that muscle like crazy. The only thing I use my bicep for is opening doors for ladies and grabbing my beer off the table. But I'm starting to get sidetracked here.

With shoulders I recommend free weights. Barbell shoulder press is the best followed by dumbbell shoulder press, dumbbell lateral raises, and dumbbell forward raises and bent over lateral raises. Pick 3 and do 2-3 sets of each.

Kris Anderson
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I can see why you don't work your shoulders mda. If you do BB bench, chins etc. they get a workout. Thats why if you look in my journal my MP is so weak. After chest my shoulders have nothing left in them. Although a couple sets of direct shouder work would be benefical IMHO.

I don't think that much direct shoulder work is necessary. A couple sets should suffice. I would recommend getting in some rear delt work, it's one of the most neglected areas IMO.

some rear delt work

I know dgee does some rear delt stuff on his back day.

Marc C. David
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>> so would you stop working out your arms?

yeah, in fact i dont include arms as a separate workout day. After chest, i do one exercise (1 set) for tri's and after back, only 1 exercise (1 set) for bi's.

>> Not working out your shoulders will likely lead to injuries in future years of lifting.

I disagree with this statement. I havent heard of any shoulder injuries due to not doing an insolated shoulder workout. Or have i had any problems in the past with moving heavy chest or back weight.

I do agree that the bicep could be excluded since it covers only 25% of the upper arm with the tri at 75%. But the bicep and Ego seem to be connected.

I don't want to discourage anyone from doing certain routines, i feel certain muscle groups dont need 100% concentration to grow, ie (forearms, bi's tri's & shoulders) The groups get excellent builds from legs, chest and back routines.

Im a firm believer that getting big starts with Legs then chest/back with a few smaller muscle group exercises in between.

But to help answer his question, any shoulder work i feel should be done with free weights. For me, machine weights seem to awkward and uncomfortable. So db shoulder press, front, side and back db raises are good as well.

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Just my two cents here- I have seen great gains in my shoulders since I started the Max OT routine, giving them a day of their own and all. I can see the logic behind the statements that your shoulders get worked out during other exercises, such as bench press, but let's face it- The shoulders perform a wide variety of movements, and my own personal opinion is to make each area of the shoulders as strong as possible in order to prevent possible injury due to underdevelopment.

>> Not working out your shoulders will likely lead to injuries in future years of lifting.

I disagree with this statement. I haven't heard of any shoulder injuries due to not doing an isolated shoulder workout. Or have i had any problems in the past with moving heavy chest or back weight.

Well you can disagree, but it's a true statement. Back in my early years of lifting when I first started I had the same attitude about shoulders that you have. I felt my shoulders were sore after my chest and back workouts so I decided they were already being hit and didn't need anymore abuse from me. How wrong I was.

I ended up damaging my rotator cuff from months of abusing my shoulders. Increasing weight on my chest and back but not building up my shoulders tore them apart. Basically, it got so bad I could not press 15lbs above my head. My sports dr. informed me (as well as the physical therapist who helped me recuperate), that my shoulders were underdeveloped for the weight I was lifting. If you don't want to hit your shoulders that's fine.. to each his own. But for those of you reading this thread, I HIGHLY recommend hitting your shoulders and giving them their own workout.

Now back to inexperience. Like I said, when I did my chest and back workouts back in my early years my shoulders were often sore. This was because of 2 things. The first was because they were underdeveloped and I was putting a lot of stress on them during my back and chest workouts. The second, and most important, was that I was lifting incorrectly. I won't get into this here because I'd have to see your workout to before saying if you're lifting correctly or not... but if your shoulders are sore after a chest workout, you are lifting incorrectly.

A buddy of mine made a comment last week that reminded me of this thread. He said "It doesn't matter how much protein you eat, it's all about calories. You can eat nothing but fat and still gain just as much muscle as a high protein diet." In theory that sounds correct... as calories do determine whether we will gain or lose weight. But we also know that the breakdown of your calories consumed is extremely important to optimize muscle growth (protein/carbs/fats).

Same goes with working out your shoulders. If you want to believe that not dedicating a workout to your shoulders will lead to muscle growth then you can... and you will most likely make some gains in the course of a year just from working out other body parts. But the fact is, you need to workout your shoulders just like every other muscle in your body to see the greatest gains and to help combat future injuries.

Kris Anderson
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Now back to inexperience. Like I said, when I did my chest and back workouts back in my early years my shoulders were often sore. This was because of 2 things. The first was because they were underdeveloped and I was putting a lot of stress on them during my back and chest workouts.

I'd like to second this. When I first started lifting back in June, I did no shoulder work, and I ended up straining my left shoulder while doing my other lifts -- it didn't help me any that my shoulders were astonishingly weak. Even after resting the shoulder for about two weeks, I still had pain in it on any exercise that would bring the shoulder into play. Anyway, now that I've been strengtening my shoulders by working them specifically, the pain is (finally) pretty much gone, and I can get a better chest or arm workout now that my shoulders aren't failing early.

ORIGINAL: Kris

>> Not working out your shoulders will likely lead to injuries in future years of lifting.

I disagree with this statement. I haven't heard of any shoulder injuries due to not doing an isolated shoulder workout. Or have i had any problems in the past with moving heavy chest or back weight.

Well you can disagree, but it's a true statement. Back in my early years of lifting when I first started I had the same attitude about shoulders that you have. I felt my shoulders were sore after my chest and back workouts so I decided they were already being hit and didn't need anymore abuse from me. How wrong I was.

I ended up damaging my rotator cuff from months of abusing my shoulders. Increasing weight on my chest and back but not building up my shoulders tore them apart. Basically, it got so bad I could not press 15lbs above my head. My sports dr. informed me (as well as the physical therapist who helped me recuperate), that my shoulders were underdeveloped for the weight I was lifting. If you don't want to hit your shoulders that's fine.. to each his own. But for those of you reading this thread, I HIGHLY recommend hitting your shoulders and giving them their own workout.

Now back to inexperience. Like I said, when I did my chest and back workouts back in my early years my shoulders were often sore. This was because of 2 things. The first was because they were underdeveloped and I was putting a lot of stress on them during my back and chest workouts. The second, and most important, was that I was lifting incorrectly. I won't get into this here because I'd have to see your workout to before saying if you're lifting correctly or not... but if your shoulders are sore after a chest workout, you are lifting incorrectly.

A buddy of mine made a comment last week that reminded me of this thread. He said "It doesn't matter how much protein you eat, it's all about calories. You can eat nothing but fat and still gain just as much muscle as a high protein diet." In theory that sounds correct... as calories do determine whether we will gain or lose weight. But we also know that the breakdown of your calories consumed is extremely important to optimize muscle growth (protein/carbs/fats).

Same goes with working out your shoulders. If you want to believe that not dedicating a workout to your shoulders will lead to muscle growth then you can... and you will most likely make some gains in the course of a year just from working out other body parts. But the fact is, you need to workout your shoulders just like every other muscle in your body to see the greatest gains and to help combat future injuries.

I disagree. The reason you probably injured your shoulder was from the improper form. Some rotator cuff work would have also benefited. One of the reasons you see such massive shoulders and traps on pro bodybuilders is because the anabolics they take give them a chance to recover from all the work they get. You don't see this in natural lifters because a lot of direct shoulder, combined with the compound chest and back work, leads to overtraining. If you want to keep your shoulders healthy I would recommend some rotator cuff work and a thorough warm up before training. Direct shoulder work is not a necessity IMO if you are doing compound chest and back work in proper form.

I disagree. The reason you probably injured your shoulder was from the improper form.

Didn't I already say this?

Now back to inexperience. Like I said, when I did my chest and back workouts back in my early years my shoulders were often sore. This was because of 2 things. The first was because they were underdeveloped and I was putting a lot of stress on them during my back and chest workouts. The second, and most important, was that I was lifting incorrectly.

And IMO, if you are getting a complete shoulder workout from your chest and back workouts, you are definitely not lifting correctly. It's too often I see people using way too much weight and then being forced to use their shoulders to "cheat" in order to complete a rep.

It's like those people who arm curls while standing. They do way too much weight and are forced to swing their body uncontrollably. Now a little swinging is ok if it's controlled... but most people don't do this in a controlled manner. When it's uncontrolled it puts stress on the lower back. So would you then say that they could rule out lower back exercises because it's already being hit by this compound movement (please don't say yes)?

What I'm saying, and what WDNinABQ is saying as well, is that we used to not workout our shoulders and that led to injuries. Now that we do workout our shoulders the pain is starting to go away. If we were lifting incorrectly wouldn't the pain be increasing??? I've also seen far better gains after working out my shoulders. I can't even believe this has become a topic of not working out a body part.

Kris Anderson
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Great post so far, im gonna ahve tog o with kris on this one.
Firstly picture yourself with huge arm great triceps and a weak deltoid? You do not build great deltoids without isolation. Im not sure how serious you take bodybuilding but if youa re trying to sculpt your body you wont skip your shoulder workout. Secondly, okay yes they get worked during secondary exercises, so are you claiming you ahve great deltoids at the moment? Bulk up and never work shoulders and you'll see how undefined and small they will remain. PEace dont be lazy work your deltoids

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