RE: Unsure of what to do...
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RE: Unsure of what to do... - 1/11/2005 6:28:21 AM
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Powerhaus
Posts: 1065
Joined: 12/17/2003
From: Oakland, CA
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Naviator, if you don't have any personal experience with real steroids, then can I assume your glowing testimonals for M1T come from their marketing material?
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RE: Unsure of what to do... - 1/11/2005 7:38:50 AM
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Naviator
Posts: 792
Joined: 9/27/2004
From: Frankfort, KY
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Were you paying attention? I have done eight cycles with two different brands: Gaspari and IDS. Wake up. Your experience is...?
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RE: Unsure of what to do... - 1/11/2005 8:11:44 AM
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axgar
Posts: 186
Joined: 1/5/2004
From: Denver, Colorado
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This is an excellent thread and I had to join....
First, learn as much as possible about your body type. Know what you will face trying to gain weight. In college (my youngest brother has your body type - ectomorph) attempted to gain weight. He ate often and bought weight gainer products. He was estatic to gain 10 lbs!!
He went home for spring break...my mother is on eternal diets.....and all she had in the fridge was healthy low gycemic, low fat foods......he lost 8 pounds in one week!!! 
I now consider myself an advanced beginner / intermediate BB lifter. I have been at it serious and hard for 1-1/2 yrs. I am just now beginning to understand what works and what is a waste of time....for my body.
In short, my body has begun to respond because it has had time to adapt, grow, and clean out. Also, I am now just beginning to "feel" the target muscle(s) working.
Believe all those with more experience when they say you must, must, must (1) eat properly (I think this is 50% - 80% of equation), (2) lift properly (there is a correct way for form but also for hypertrophy), and (3) mentally focus on the target muscle (surprise! there more to growth than just lifting!!!). Good Luck and All the best! 
< Message edited by axgar -- 1/11/2005 8:14:58 AM >
(in reply to DrumProdigy83)
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RE: Unsure of what to do... - 1/11/2005 8:29:41 AM
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Marc David
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From: Bay Area -CA
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So basically you feel out of the loop?
Your friends and co-workers are doing it. You have some time before med school and you can't keep up the routine so you might as well try it too?
If you are going to do it:
1) Do it for money (like the IFBB pros)
2) Do it for yourself
Will you really be happy gaining all this muscle, learning how to admin stuff properly and then quit? I think you are going for an image. To get bigger. Once you get that, it's not something you just walk from now that you are busy. If you gained 50 lbs of muscle or more during this window of opportunity, would you be fine if you lost it all or most of it once you started med school? Or would you try and get back to that image of being big?
The thing is... what I read into this (all we can really do is read what you post and interpret what you mean) is that you want this image of being bigger. Your current size is not enough. You'd like to take a few shortcuts to get to where you want to be. Once you start med school and you has less time, you'll bail on this. But right now you have the time, buds are doing it, why the heck not?
Because it's an image you want. Once you are there, you are not likely to just "let it go." You will try and maintain. And you won't be able to do it naturally.
Who drinks alcohol "just over the summer"
Who just smokes pot only in 10th grade and then never gain
Who just speeds ONLY when they are late for something
Who just swears only when they are mad
Once you start something, you are likely to continue until you:
1) Cannot afford it
2) Get caught
3) Have a medical issue where you are forced to stop
I'm not at all implying you will abuse this substance. But I highly doubt you will just do it for a few months and then be done...forever.
Just know the facts before you go down the path. Facts are not that all your friends are doing it and they seem to be doing great.
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RE: Unsure of what to do... - 1/11/2005 8:34:20 AM
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Naviator
Posts: 792
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From: Frankfort, KY
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Extremely well put. Preach it, brother man.
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RE: Unsure of what to do... - 1/11/2005 8:35:40 AM
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Powerhaus
Posts: 1065
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From: Oakland, CA
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Naviator: Question...if you're so anti-steroid (as demonstrated in an earlier post), why are you so enthusiatic about products you claim are essentially steroids?
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RE: Unsure of what to do... - 1/11/2005 8:40:58 AM
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Naviator
Posts: 792
Joined: 9/27/2004
From: Frankfort, KY
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Read my posts. I don't see where you can call me an advocate of prohormones. As much as I hate the idea of "Government by Nanny" (I wear my helmet because I want to, BTW) I am glad to see M-1T go away. Some ****er stupider than me is going to get himself hurt on that crap because he's young and impatient. I have done 1-AD also and it doesn't even stand in the same league. I don't like any prohormone and will never take another, but M-1T is bar none the most villainous.
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(in reply to Powerhaus)
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RE: Unsure of what to do... - 1/11/2005 8:46:50 AM
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Powerhaus
Posts: 1065
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From: Oakland, CA
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quote:
I don't see where you can call me an advocate of prohormones.
Hmmm....
quote:
I myself have used Methyl One-Test and gained quite a few pounds from it and actually kept some.
quote:
I have done more than my share of Methyl One-Test. I was on it long enough to reach a plateau through two cycles.
quote:
It is by far the most potent prohormone in existence and is, for all intents and purposes, a steroid.
_____________________________
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Where's MY book deal?
(in reply to Naviator)
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RE: Unsure of what to do... - 1/11/2005 8:48:24 AM
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Powerhaus
Posts: 1065
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From: Oakland, CA
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Oh...and also:
quote:
Natural bodybuilding is for those that name their own destiny and can appreciate the life going on around them during the journey.
So what is it?
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RE: Unsure of what to do... - 1/11/2005 8:49:54 AM
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Naviator
Posts: 792
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From: Frankfort, KY
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quote:
I have been down the Prohormone trail and let me tell you that I will never do it again. Yep, I said that.
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RE: Unsure of what to do... - 1/11/2005 8:58:08 AM
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Naviator
Posts: 792
Joined: 9/27/2004
From: Frankfort, KY
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quote:
I myself have used Methyl One-Test and gained quite a few pounds from it and actually kept some. I am certain that had I quit lifting altogether my gains would have disappeared within a few weeks. In contrast, I have been on a natural program for 3 months now and have enjoyed gains beyond those from the M1-T. I got extremely sick for two weeks and it took only a week to get right back on track. I remember being on 1-AD and losing every ounce of gain from being only slightly sick for a week.
Said that, too. Makes a little more impact when taken in context.
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RE: Unsure of what to do... - 1/11/2005 8:59:53 AM
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Powerhaus
Posts: 1065
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From: Oakland, CA
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Well consiering it's in the contect of dealing with a teenager who is looking for an easy way out, I'm sure he took it as a resounding endorsement.
I have run into plenty of guys who are all self-righteous about "natrual" bodybuilding, but are popping any pill the supplement indusry comes up with, claiming it's actually a steroid that's been slipped under the FDA radar somehow. Then again, I've met guys who think that you're not "natural" if you use powdered protein, too. I'm really not sure who's more annoying...
In any case, it's clear that this young man is looking for a supplment or a drug that will make up for him not being able to work out in the future. If this kid really IS heading for medical school, I am nervous.
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Where's MY book deal?
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RE: Unsure of what to do... - 1/11/2005 9:43:51 AM
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DrumProdigy83
Posts: 16
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MDA1125 you kind of hit the nail right on the head with your post. It is for my own personal contentment to put on weight, and it is also because I am so tired of people always calling me skinny. I'm 21 and I've been skinny my whole life, and now I think it's time to move on. The thing is, you guys say I can get these tremendous gains now if I went with steroids or PHs but after I stop lifting in medical school (they say you lose your life to your studies, so I am assuming I won't be working out... then again I do see a lot of in shape doctors so who knows) - that is IF it is really not possible to work out at all, why would I even bother working out now "naturally"? Whether I gain size naturally or through the aid of some other legal or illegal substances, once I stop lifting I will lose the weight....
While I am athletic and love sports, my true loves are in my academic studies and my drumming. I love playing sports and keeping fit, but when I am in the gym pumping iron I don't get the same feeling as when I am playing or teaching drums... it is my passion. Life is full of risks and as long as I am able to make educated and informed decisions the potentially hazardous risks are to be made potentially less hazardous. Knowledge is power, and as long as I don't abuse the drugs (and learn how to use them properly and incorporate them into a healthy workout schedule) I should be fine. I don't want to get ripped like Arnold, I just want to put on 15-20lbs and keep it. If I get to 15-20lbs in a few months (I don't know how realistic that is) then I won't need steroids or PHs anymore. From that point on I'll just keep doing what I'm doing.
From my perspective steroids or PHs would really just give me a rolling start... give me some momentum to get more out of my workout. It does take so long to put on weight and I won't be able to get as big as if I was taking either of those supplements.... and the absolute KILLER is that I will work my ass off for a year and a half just to lose the weight and never achieve the size/strength that I wanted all along? Yikes! I'm 6'1" ~ 6'2" and 163lbs... I'm sure I will start filling out in the next couple of years so who knows. I just got back from the gym and my body is sore but no different. If I look a little bigger now in the morning I will go back to the size I was before I lifted. I have patience but you've really got to loooooove lifting in order to have this kind of patience.
You know what, since I certainly don't know everything there is to know about lifting and gaining weight, and since you guys are all so very against either of these supplements, what can I do to gain the weight I want and keep it on given my circumstances? I know all about the diet part... lots of protein, less fats, less carbs, multivitamins and green leafy vegetables... rest, don't work the same body part day after day back to back... I know what exercises to do... protein shakes... I gained 10lbs in a few months and was definitely stronger but when I had to stop lifting I just lost my muscle mass and strength gradually after every month of not lifting. That's why I feel stupid even having a gym membership at all, but to be honest my body fat % had gone up and for the first time in my life I started getting a slight belly (no good!) so I ran to the gym and got a year membership. In just 2 weeks I've already gained back significant definition in my abs and that little bulge is pretty much gone. I don't know what to do I feel so lost and confused like it's pointless for me to work out at all.  
(in reply to Powerhaus)
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RE: Unsure of what to do... - 1/11/2005 9:55:40 AM
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Powerhaus
Posts: 1065
Joined: 12/17/2003
From: Oakland, CA
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Steroids are not a "rolling start". You should go as far as you can on self-discipline, hard work, good diet, etc, before you should even consider putting the additional strain on your body that steroids or PH's would put on it. Most people are amazed at how much progress they can make natually if they just stick with it.
_____________________________
"Eat Less, Exericise More"
Where's MY book deal?
(in reply to DrumProdigy83)
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RE: Unsure of what to do... - 1/11/2005 10:06:10 AM
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nickflnj
Posts: 456
Joined: 1/21/2004
From: New Jersey
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quote:
what can I do to gain the weight I want and keep it on given my circumstances? I know all about the diet part... lots of protein, less fats, less carbs, multivitamins and green
Your wrong about the less carb part. You want to gain, your gonna need lots of carbs
(in reply to Powerhaus)
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RE: Unsure of what to do... - 1/11/2005 10:12:31 AM
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Marc David
Posts: 6742
Joined: 4/6/2003
From: Bay Area -CA
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I understand and appreciate your confusion. There's a lot of info out there. Many of it conflicting.
quote:
If I get to 15-20lbs in a few months (I don't know how realistic that is) then I won't need steroids or PHs anymore. From that point on I'll just keep doing what I'm doing.
Not possible. You can't just put on 15-20 lbs of muscle, then not need a drug and continue what you were doing. You won't keep that muscle. Some yes, majority no. Your body naturally won't support all that muscle, now matter how hard you work out.
Which goes back to my image statement. You are tied of being skinny. Well, if this is the route you take, you won't just "get big" overnight and then quit and stay big. Nope. Your body will go back to it's natural testosterone cycle and it won't be able to support what you just put on.
I've seen plenty of guys on steroids. They are huge quickly and get small just as fast and yet, they workout hard. It's just not possible to keep it. And most of them had a fair amount of muscle when they started.
Case in point, I was 130 lbs in high school at age 19.
I'm now 194 lbs.
I'm much happier now but I had to put in my time.
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RE: Unsure of what to do... - 1/11/2005 10:36:58 AM
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DrumProdigy83
Posts: 16
Joined: 1/9/2005
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Carbs are tricky because yes it is energy to burn, but unfortunately the carbs that aren't burned are stored as fat... and that gets compounded every time I take in a load of carbs that I can't burn off completely. Lean mass is what I want, so I need to be very specific with the amount of carbs I take it....
MDA, how old are you now? How did you gain so much mass? Is it mostly muscle mass (I'm assuming it is)? I kind of have a feeling that I will be able to lift while in medical school because it is supposed to be very stressful and BECAUSE it's medical school they will probably stress healthy living etc, so I'm sure they will probably have gyms around to promote healthy lifestyles while in med school (to give students a chance to get up from studying). However, I don't think it would be realistic to assume that I would be able to workout a lot in the gym like I am able to do now as an undergrad. A lot of the doctors and surgeons and stuff I see are all in pretty good shape so I am thinking they probably started lifting either before med school or during and made a habit out of it that continued even after they started practicing.
OK, so you put on about 65lbs of muscle roughly without using supplements? I want to gain about 20lbs or so (from 165lbs to 180-190lbs). You are saying I shouldn't do steroids or PHs because I don't have enough time/experience under my belt. Then you say I need time/patience to naturally put on the weight. So like I said before, it seems like I lose either way because I don't have what it takes to achieve my goal through natural or "synthetic" workout techniques. What do I do????
(in reply to axgar)
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