RE: Help
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RE: Help - 1/31/2007 6:04:45 AM
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saternal
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Good to hear other's need help =D i've been swarming this thread with questions non stop.
(in reply to XtremeSki2001)
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RE: Help - 1/31/2007 7:47:19 AM
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danmirage
Posts: 6023
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quote:
Dan, would you suggest one of the three plans you linked to above for losing fat over the max-ot program?
Yes. Why? I have to look at the OT program to be sure of this, but it pushes the boundaries of overtraining. This is basically a hormonal state that does not favor fat loss.
Also, the program you want to do should ideally combine hypertrophy work with higher rep work to maximize muscle gains across all fiber types...
quote:
He says choose a weight that takes me to failure at the last rep of the last set. Does this mean i use the same weight throughout the 3 sets?
Choose a weight that forces you to near-failure for the last rep of the last set.
Yes. however if you find you are stronger, then bump up to a more appropriate weight.
quote:
If i did cardio as part of the off days, how long should i do it for?
The name of the game is progression. See my notes on cardio (including the link on cardio progression) in my Losing Fat / Gaining Mass threads.
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And should i eat something before going for abs/cardio.
Yes that is in my threads when it says "for stand-alone cardio."
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Its ok to do cardio just by itself?
Yes
quote:
cause i heard its best to to it after a workout to burn the fat.
Either first thing AM before a meal (take the PWO) or post workout are the most ideal fat burning times.
However, doing appropriate cardio at other times can burn some fat as well.
Not as much as a bout of resistance training and 24 hours of rest and optimal meals will do.
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So should i do abs 1st or cardio.
Finish with abs
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And is it alright to take a break for 2 weeks? this week and next before i start on this program?
ABOLUTELY!
Just eat right!
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Also, in a few weeks time i'll be going on holiday and i'm not sure if i can follow this programm strictly. Will this be detrimental to the plan?
Not at all! Just eat right and have fun!
Come back and start with a week of low intensity training...then start up again.
Your results after a layoff will be fantastic.
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My journal:
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_158705/mpage_2/tm.htm
Primers:
Gaining Mass
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_111173/mpage_1/tm.htm
Losing Fat
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_111175/mpage_1/tm.htm
(in reply to XtremeSki2001)
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RE: Help - 1/31/2007 9:24:22 AM
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XtremeSki2001
Posts: 412
Joined: 1/16/2007
From: Philly, PA
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quote:
ORIGINAL: danmirage
quote:
Dan, would you suggest one of the three plans you linked to above for losing fat over the max-ot program?
Yes. Why? I have to look at the OT program to be sure of this, but it pushes the boundaries of overtraining. This is basically a hormonal state that does not favor fat loss.
Thanks. I'll probably make some modifications to my current workout/diet and post back later. Thanks again for all your help.
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RE: Help - 1/31/2007 6:40:17 PM
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XtremeSki2001
Posts: 412
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From: Philly, PA
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Hi Dan ... spent quite a bit of time manually entering all my foodss into fitday for future reference ... it's giving me a better idea what I'm eating.
You mentioned that ideally to lose fat I should be consuming 25/50/25 (protein/carbs/fat). Also, using the KM/HB formula, it says for a lightly active person I should consume 2889/3068 calories respectively. So to lose weight I should consume 2311/2048 calories respectively. I'm not sure what my body fat is, but I put 22% because I think that's somewhat accurate.
I've taken some time and I've created one days meal. What do you think?
Meal 1 - 7:00am
Special K w/ berries
1 glass OJ
465 cals - 0 fat - 89 carbs - 9 protein
Meal 2 - 10:30am
Danon Light & Fit
60 cals - 0 fat - 10 carbs - 5 protein
Meal 3 - 12:30pm
PBJ
660 cals - 35 fat - 48 carbs - 24 protein
Meal 4 - 4:00pm
Special K Breakfast Bar
90 cals - 2 fat - 18 carbs - 1 protein
Meal 5 - 6:30pm
Chicken Breast Baked
Brown Rice (not sure what grain, how do I know?)
A little bit of BBQ sauce for flavor
1157 cals - 17 fat - 74 carbs - 148 protein
Total : 2612 cals - 59 fat - 295 carbs - 215 protein or 34/45/21 (protein/carbs/fat).
Overall, I'm right on % and calories wise, maybe a bit high on the calories.
However, I guess my day is ass backwards with my big meal at night, is this OK? I welcome any suggestions.
I'm good with the workout plan, just always had problems with meals and nutrition.
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RE: Help - 1/31/2007 7:25:39 PM
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danmirage
Posts: 6023
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quote:
spent quite a bit of time manually entering all my foodss into fitday for future reference ... it's giving me a better idea what I'm eating
Great work!!!!
quote:
You mentioned that ideally to lose fat I should be consuming 25/50/25 (protein/carbs/fat).
NO!!!
I gave that as a better starting point. Every person has a unique chemistry adn the ideal ratio is different person to person! You wil need to pay attention and experiment.
quote:
Also, using the KM/HB formula, it says for a lightly active person I should consume 2889/3068 calories respectively. So to lose weight I should consume 2311/2048 calories respectively. I'm not sure what my body fat is, but I put 22% because I think that's somewhat accurate.
First thing first....when the goal is fat loss, you should start at the higher end of your range for calories.
SEcond, if you are already eating a diet..start where you are!
Now that meal plan!!!
Read my losing fat thread and look at the meal plan rules and example.
You should eat the best food choices you can ans focus on whole foods.
Rule #1 Every meal...
Lean Protein
Starchy Carb
Fibrous carb
Whole foods not processed.
quote:
Meal 1 - 7:00am
Special K w/ berries
1 glass OJ
465 cals - 0 fat - 89 carbs - 9 protein
No juice...thats like asking to store fat!
Processed cereal is the same! Just sugar!
This is not a complete meal
You also should have essential fats..like Fish Oil (purified-like carlson's)
quote:
Meal 2 - 10:30am
Danon Light & Fit
60 cals - 0 fat - 10 carbs - 5 protein
Milk prods are not ideal if the goal is fat loss
This is not a complete meal
quote:
Meal 3 - 12:30pm
PBJ
660 cals - 35 fat - 48 carbs - 24 protein
bread is not ideal if the goal is fat loss!
This is not a complete meal
How do you get 24 grams of protein!?
quote:
Meal 4 - 4:00pm
Special K Breakfast Bar
90 cals - 2 fat - 18 carbs - 1 protein
Breakfast bars are invitations to GAIN fat!
This is not a complete meal
quote:
Meal 5 - 6:30pm
Chicken Breast Baked
Brown Rice (not sure what grain, how do I know?)
A little bit of BBQ sauce for flavor
1157 cals - 17 fat - 74 carbs - 148 protein
This is not a complete meal
Where is the vegetable?
Too much protein!
Total : 2612 cals - 59 fat - 295 carbs - 215 protein or 34/45/21 (protein/carbs/fat).
The ratio there is not good...but the calories are not bad...Start HIGER!!!!
Eating whole foods BURNS calories!!! and supports Building muscle...MUSCLE BURNS FAT
Muscle is THE PLACE in the body where fat is burned!
Sorry to rough it up..but I want you to get on the right path!!!
Why waste time.
_____________________________
My journal:
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_158705/mpage_2/tm.htm
Primers:
Gaining Mass
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_111173/mpage_1/tm.htm
Losing Fat
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_111175/mpage_1/tm.htm
(in reply to XtremeSki2001)
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RE: Help - 1/31/2007 8:54:52 PM
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saternal
Posts: 442
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Dan is it ok to eat food with some sauce like Chilli Sauce , Ketchup , Mustard? Most of the time i cook my meat plain but the taste is getting abit blend so i was wondering if i could add some seasoning to the cooking?
(in reply to danmirage)
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RE: Help - 2/1/2007 1:01:29 AM
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saternal
Posts: 442
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I'm gonna write out a meal plan again around next week to see if its ok. I've been testing for the past 2 weeks now and i hope it makes a good plan.
Back to the question on weight to choose. For the 3rd week when i increase my sets, do i still do the same weight that i did for the 1st week? Because now i'm doing more reps and sets means it gets tougher. So is that the point?
(in reply to danmirage)
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RE: Help - 2/1/2007 5:42:31 AM
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saternal
Posts: 442
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Lets say i choose to workout 1 hour after a meal. I drink my whey protein half hour later and again after my workout. However does this mean that my meal 1 hour before and 1 hour after my workout has got to be less in protein? or none? because when i calculate out my eating plan i tend to overshoot the amount of protein i should take hence carb % is messed up.
My calorie intake should be around 2300-2400 having minused off 500 calories for cutting. I find myself eating more protein then i should. However i don't really know how to cut down on the protein. On days i don't train i find i eat the right amount of protein. But on days i train i tend to over eat on protein.
(in reply to danmirage)
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RE: Help - 2/1/2007 2:01:59 PM
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XtremeSki2001
Posts: 412
Joined: 1/16/2007
From: Philly, PA
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OK ... I'm looking at 2600-2800 calories a day. That's what I currently consume and that's what I'll continue to consume until a plataue is reached.
I don't know the specifics on some of these, but I tried my best ... it's a better start. I'd like to get this all together before I go food shopping this weekend 
Meal 1
4 egg whites with 1 yoke (FYI ... I typically buy large grade A eggs and I'm not sure of their nutritional values when then yoke is removed)
1 cup oatmeal (I hate oatmeal, so I'll probably slurp it down with water ... any type of Oatmeal you'd recommend)
Baby Carrots
Meal 2
Cottage Cheese (could this be my lean protein?)
1 slice 100% whole wheat bread
Baby Carrots
Meal 3
I typically eat a sandwich ... so this is hard for me
Turkey Salad (knocks out the lean protein AND fibrous carb)
Corn
Meal 4
I'm stumped ... I'm a picky eater and I like quick and short meals
Perhaps a rice mix ... brown rice, peas, and chicken with soy sauce?
Meal 5
Chicken Breast
Corn
Celery w/ peanut butter?
Meal 6
This is typically later at night ... again looking for quick and easy
I wanna say apple, but from your guide it's probably not ideal ...
Ugh....
Carrots and cottage cheese
Is this ok? Like I said, this is around 8 or later so I just like a small snack
OK ... thanks for your help thus far Dan. You can be rough, I don't mind someone yelling at me to get me motivated haha! I have all the foods out above ... now I need to work on the portions. Can you let me know what you think? Once you say it's good, I'll work on the amounts.
Fish Oil? Egh, this is new to me. Where would I fit this in my meal? Is it taken str8 up like a shot haha?
Other than the fish oil ... I'm on the right track I feel.
Thanks again.
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(in reply to danmirage)
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RE: Help - 2/1/2007 10:54:05 PM
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saternal
Posts: 442
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What's the best way to calculate calorie intake? i use one of the calculators on Bodybuilding.com. It tells me i burn roughly 2822 calories per day.
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RE: Help - 2/2/2007 7:37:27 AM
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danmirage
Posts: 6023
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quote:
What's the best way to calculate calorie intake?
Calorie intake is all the calories you eat..use Fitday.com ..sign up for th free meal journal and enter everything you eat.
Caloric expenditure formula are based on some obscure references...they can give you a general idea of where to start but ARE NOT PERFECT!
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/How_Many_Calories_Do_You_Need%3a_Calorie_Calculators_-_Includes_Quick_Spreadsheet_Too!/m_45013/tm.htm
Once you start dialing in a diet and training plan, then your actual calories out will change and YOU control the number.
quote:
Meal 1
4 egg whites with 1 yoke (FYI ... I typically buy large grade A eggs and I'm not sure of their nutritional values when then yoke is removed)
1 cup oatmeal (I hate oatmeal, so I'll probably slurp it down with water ... any type of Oatmeal you'd recommend)
Baby Carrots
Meal 2
Cottage Cheese (could this be my lean protein?) It is not ideal if the goal is fat loss..any milk product Will not be ideal. Try thin sliced beef instead.
1 slice 100% whole wheat bread if the goal is fat loss then bread is not ideal
Baby Carrots I recommend getting as much variety in your vegetables as you can
Meal 3
I typically eat a sandwich ... so this is hard for me if the goal is fat loss then bread is not ideal
Turkey Salad (knocks out the lean protein AND fibrous carb)
Corn
Meal 4
I'm stumped ... I'm a picky eater and I like quick and short meals
Perhaps a rice mix ... brown rice, peas, and chicken with soy sauce? Well, peas are a carb not a vegetable...look at my foods list in the gaining mass or losing fat thread. How about onions peppers and mushroom?
Meal 5
Chicken Breast
Corn What about baked sweet potato?
Celery w/ peanut butter?
Meal 6
This is typically later at night ... again looking for quick and easy
I wanna say apple, but from your guide it's probably not ideal ...
Ugh....
Carrots and cottage cheese if the goal is fat loss then milk products are not ideal
Is this OK? Like I said, this is around 8 or later so I just like a small snack
Forget the word snack. focus on the concept of complete meals. How about fish, rice and a salad?
Use fitday.com and put EACH MEAL in a separate day..this way you can see how the portion sizes and ratios of fat, carbs, and protein work out!
quote:
Fish Oil? Egh, this is new to me. Where would I fit this in my meal? Is it taken str8 up like a shot haha?
I use this:
Fish Oil
I use a teaspoon and just ..yea take it str8 up as a shooter. 
_____________________________
My journal:
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_158705/mpage_2/tm.htm
Primers:
Gaining Mass
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_111173/mpage_1/tm.htm
Losing Fat
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_111175/mpage_1/tm.htm
(in reply to saternal)
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RE: Help - 2/2/2007 8:28:57 AM
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XtremeSki2001
Posts: 412
Joined: 1/16/2007
From: Philly, PA
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: danmirage
quote:
Meal 1
4 egg whites with 1 yoke (FYI ... I typically buy large grade A eggs and I'm not sure of their nutritional values when then yoke is removed)
1 cup oatmeal (I hate oatmeal, so I'll probably slurp it down with water ... any type of Oatmeal you'd recommend)
Baby Carrots
Since you made no comments, I guess this meal is ok?
Meal 2
Cottage Cheese (could this be my lean protein?) It is not ideal if the goal is fat loss..any milk product Will not be ideal. Try thin sliced beef instead.
1 slice 100% whole wheat bread if the goal is fat loss then bread is not ideal
Baby Carrots I recommend getting as much variety in your vegetables as you can
Roast beef from a deli ... is this ok? Or perhaps it's better to cook a lean cut of beef and slice it myself?
Instead of bread ... one cup of brown rice?
Celery instead of carrots
Meal 3
Turkey Salad (knocks out the lean protein AND fibrous carb)
Corn
Is this ok then?
Meal 4
Perhaps a rice mix ... brown rice, peas, and chicken with soy sauce? Well, peas are a carb not a vegetable...look at my foods list in the gaining mass or losing fat thread. How about onions peppers and mushroom?
I see my problem now .. peas are a starchy carb. I'll use broccoli instead. (I don't like onions or peppers or mushrooms haha ... I'm picky)
Meal 5
Chicken Breast
Corn What about baked sweet potato?
Celery w/ peanut butter?
I'll give it a try ... you suggest a whole sweet potato?
Meal 6
Carrots and cottage cheese if the goal is fat loss then milk products are not ideal
Is this OK? Like I said, this is around 8 or later so I just like a small snack
Forget the word snack. focus on the concept of complete meals. How about fish, rice and a salad?
I know, it's tough to get in the habit of meals when I typically always had 3 meals and 2 snacks. Fish, Rice, and salad sounds good, I'll try that.
Use fitday.com and put EACH MEAL in a separate day..this way you can see how the portion sizes and ratios of fat, carbs, and protein work out!
quote:
Fish Oil? Egh, this is new to me. Where would I fit this in my meal? Is it taken str8 up like a shot haha?
I use this:
Fish Oil
I use a teaspoon and just ..yea take it str8 up as a shooter.
A teaspoon at the begining or end of each meal ... or does it not matter? I guess this is for a "good fat". I hope it tastes better then it sounds.
I'm getting close to getting this down ... thanks again for the help, I REALLY appreciate it.
One more question ... is there particular oatmeal I should purchase for my breakfast?
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RE: Help - 2/2/2007 8:36:23 AM
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saternal
Posts: 442
Joined: 10/19/2006
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Having calculated how much i should eat i took my BMR x 1.55(activity level i think its moderate, not sure though)
i get close to 3000 calories. So basically i shouldn't minus 500 off these calories per day? just eat 3000 worth and then use the workouts as the deficiets? 3000 is alot
If i Based my intake on 45% carb , 30% protein , 25% fat. Thats ~340g carb , 225g protein and 84g fat. So far i've been eating ~200g carb . 180g protein and 60g fat. How am i gonna increase my carb intake by so much???
Also for my workout routine, I've been trying to choose the suitable exercise to do during that workout. I understand that certain exercises don't need to be done if i'm doing a certain exercise. (for e.g. how do i knw if i should do bicep curls on one day?) or how to know if i should do a pull-down one day?). And i'll be taking a trip to the gym next week to test out some of the weights and get my plan into gear before i start the following week =D
< Message edited by saternal -- 2/2/2007 9:06:01 AM >
(in reply to danmirage)
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RE: Help - 2/2/2007 11:45:54 AM
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danmirage
Posts: 6023
Joined: 11/20/2005
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Roast beef from a deli ... is this ok? Or perhaps it's better to cook a lean cut of beef and slice it myself?
Thats what I prefer to do.
Instead of bread ... one cup of brown rice?
Celery instead of carrots
Thats nice.
A teaspoon at the begining or end of each meal ... or does it not matter? I guess this is for a "good fat". I hope it tastes better then it sounds.
Well, 2 teaspoons to 4 teaspoons a day is the ideal daily amount. You can split it up or do it in the AM ..as you wish.
As for portion sizes..this is dicated by your caloric target!
Use Fitday.com to play with the portion sizes to get all the meals about the same.
_____________________________
My journal:
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_158705/mpage_2/tm.htm
Primers:
Gaining Mass
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_111173/mpage_1/tm.htm
Losing Fat
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_111175/mpage_1/tm.htm
(in reply to saternal)
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RE: Help - 2/2/2007 11:59:54 AM
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danmirage
Posts: 6023
Joined: 11/20/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
If i Based my intake on 45% carb , 30% protein , 25% fat. Thats ~340g carb , 225g protein and 84g fat. So far i've been eating ~200g carb . 180g protein and 60g fat. How am i gonna increase my carb intake by so much???
Ideally you want to shift that to:
Protien 20-25%
Carbs 45-50%
Fat 20-30%
While optimal rages are in this range...
Protein-15-25%,
carbohydrates-45-75%,
fat-10-30%
...of your total calories
Now, you do it by making a meal plan that insures you get lean protein, starch and veggies every meal! Whole foods!!....I give lots of examples on my losing fat post.
Excessively high protein intake is not necessarily going to benefit you!
However, unless you take a week off training, there will be an adjustment.
quote:
i get close to 3000 calories. So basically i shouldn't minus 500 off these calories per day? just eat 3000 worth and then use the workouts as the deficiets? 3000 is alot
If you are currently eating 2000 then you have to adjust from THAT NUMBER not START OVER with a formula!!!
Are you gaining losing or at maintenance with 2000?
Anyway how about 2400 for a new start?
Protien 25% 150 grams
Carbs 45% 270 grams
Fat 30% 67 grams
Out of curiosity:
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/How_Many_Calories_Do_You_Need%3a_Calorie_Calculators_-_Includes_Quick_Spreadsheet_Too!/m_45013/tm.htm
open the spreadsheet at the bottom of the page and put your info in there...how much protein (lower right) and what calorie range does it give?
_____________________________
My journal:
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_158705/mpage_2/tm.htm
Primers:
Gaining Mass
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_111173/mpage_1/tm.htm
Losing Fat
http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/m_111175/mpage_1/tm.htm
(in reply to danmirage)
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RE: Help - 2/2/2007 12:33:05 PM
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XtremeSki2001
Posts: 412
Joined: 1/16/2007
From: Philly, PA
Status: offline
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Thanks again Dan ... I should a a full meal plan tomorrow, AWESOME! I'll post it here for the final approval
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(in reply to danmirage)
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