What’s My Genetic Muscular Potential?

In 19 years, I've never seen a better summary and dissertation on a person's fitness potential. Sure beats the endless arguments or "who knows" debates. Lyle does a bang up job going over some interesting and little known formulas.

What’s My Genetic Muscular Potential?

Marc C. David - NGA CPT
Author of NoBull Bodybuilding
www.nobullbodybuilding.com

Well worth the read Marc- Thanks for posting!

ACE-CPT, NASM-CPT, AFPA-Nutrition Consultant 

The one thing I have to say about all of these calculators that are supposed to predict outcomes and such is how do you explain those who defy what our calculations tell us? How can these deviations from scientific study and understanding be measured, and if they could be, can we harness their deviation?

The abundance of chemical reactions that occur during all stages of life deem it so possible that a mutagen of some kind could come into play and defy all that we have discovered and made dogmatic theory. I am not downplaying these calculations nor theories, however, I find these deviations from normality fascinating, and to those researching, for instance muscle potentials, how can you actually plot a course of an individual without taking into consideration all of the possible imperfections his anatomical and biological structure could possess?

    I'm taking this to another level, one of which might not have an answer yet, however I believe that these calculators and similar devices are produced to lock in someone to a predetermined destiny, in this case muscle potential. However yet, I also believe that if we are given a graphed design of where we will be, what we will be, and how we will be...what if we don't like it? What if we find imperfection? What if, we see the future result as one huge catastrophe and that all we work for, all we have learned, is worth nothing? This instance should create a personal drive to be our own deviation, to go away from what is expected. We are expected to gain 15 pounds of muscle, then 10, then 5, etc but why can't we defy that expectation? 
    
    Science says we can't, but what if we could? What if we wanted to? What if, it were a tangible possibility? Expectations are parallels to limitations, and I am a keen and stern enthusiast that limitations are rules that are created to be shattered. If we are destined to do one thing, therefore we are limited to be that painted picture. To hell with that. I understand that we use such potential devices for genetic engineering and genetic timelines, however, they are not always correct. Deviate, create your own path, do not go where others have gone or how others have set for you. I feel that we are on this planet to test ourselves and rebel against what is set for us. 
    Now I'm not saying go destroy the government, however yet, what I'm saying is if you are scientifically destined to fail in your pursuit of a career during your third year in college, and this is proven through some crazy calculation; look at it, understand, and say no. If calculations tells us that we will be one thing, I don't want to be that. I want to be me, and I want to be an individual. 

"Do not go where the path may lead, instead go where there is no path and leave a trail." 

Current Supplements: Multi, Whey, Caffeine, BCAA, Vitamin C, Calcium
Current Cycle: Strength

"Do not go where the path may lead, instead go where there is no path, and leave a trail."

Theres always going to be exceptions to the rules.

I dont think its as far as your taking it, I think its sort of a guidline of what you can expect, not necessarily whats going to occur.

6'3"  @213

Squat 1x20x275

press:200, Deadlift:475, Bench:300, P.clean:235, Squat:385

"The only failure that is final is to stop trying to improve"

It's the best method I've seen on at least the debates vs...

* Who knows
* I don't know
* Nobody knows

Sure there's variables.  It's NOT the end all be all to something we don't know... but given that the question comes up 100 times a year on any forum... this is the best answer or attempted answer to the impossible question that I've seen.

Marc C. David - NGA CPT
Author of NoBull Bodybuilding
www.nobullbodybuilding.com

lol according to these im pretty much at my peak.  Scary.  I got one more bulk in me though.  Well see if I can prove this wrong.

working on explosive phase
vertical: 35
weight: 206

Big 3: 300/440/515

Strength and growth come only through continuous effort and struggle.

It pretty much confirmed the exact limit I thought I could achieve.

V,
    You're the Clipart Photoshop GOD!

 

I always take things to the next level...it's more fun that way.

Current Supplements: Multi, Whey, Caffeine, BCAA, Vitamin C, Calcium
Current Cycle: Strength

"Do not go where the path may lead, instead go where there is no path, and leave a trail."

Its all very logical really .... You cant keep growing forever, unless you dont take drugs ... same goes with strength. There will be a point that you will hit and will never be able to go past it.

Problem is, that something like 70% of people who walk into a gym take drugs at some point or another, and therefor this is why most people exceed these normal expectations.

I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the morning, that's as good as they're going to feel all day. - Frank Sinatra

this really seams like the truth.  However it puts me under my one day goals.  According to height wrist and ankle calculation my max LBM weight will be 175 lbs roughly.  I always wanted to get up to like 185lbs lbm, but i guess if i can get to roughly 185 lbs and 5% bodyfat i would still be really happy.

According to this I have a little more than 10 lbs of lbm to gain before I reach my potential, and it will take me a couple years probably.  I dunno how to calculate how long i have been lifting properly and if years that i trained before i took a break count.  when i weight 155 2+ years ago and was training again I gained about 10 lbs in the first year, then I started training a little more regularly and have gained 40 lbs in a year, although a lot is fat. So if I am to reach my genetic potential I will have to keep gaining weight pure muscle to reach 219 lbs roughly, then I could cut down to 185 and have the 5% bf.  The last couple months I have been slowly gaining weight but have lost a little fat, I'm going to do my best to reach the 175 lbs of lbm in the next year even though it might take me an extra year.
 
Edit: of course this is if i were to consider the article doctrine.  If I can beat it that's great too, but I think this could help you make reasonable and attainable goals.

http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/Seos-Log-2008-m442008.aspx

I think that those calculators are pretty cool and it gives real world potential and saying squat more eat this ect ect wont change the outcome other than maybe reaching that level slightly sooner.

My ideal bodyweight at ~10% bodyfat is 232 pounds that puts me right at 12 pounds to go, and its funny because my goals have always been to reach around 235 i guess i picked a good weight haha.

These are calculations of which you are challenged to conquer and soar above. That, in itself, should be the measure of which these are viewed.

Current Supplements: Multi, Whey, Caffeine, BCAA, Vitamin C, Calcium
Current Cycle: Strength

"Do not go where the path may lead, instead go where there is no path, and leave a trail."

Its scary how they do seem pretty accurate as far as LBM goes. But The author does make a great point in saying...

"Years of proper training"
 
Which just cant be stressed enough on this site or anywhere. Which includes a proper diet to grow, which is more often then not the main reason people see no or little gains on any program.

Is it a coincidence I have made nearly all of my "gains" within the past year-ish? because its about the time I started to really train properly.

Of course I have said there are always going to be exceptions to the "rules" and there will be people who wont gain as fast even with proper training. But I have to admit, that was a great article and I enjoyed reading it, should be stickied IMO

6'3"  @213

Squat 1x20x275

press:200, Deadlift:475, Bench:300, P.clean:235, Squat:385

"The only failure that is final is to stop trying to improve"

Id like to point out that I am almost right at my peak according to these calculators and it only took me two years.  Ive been very focused these 2 years though.  I guess Im trying to say that it is possible to make alot of progress in a short time if you go all out.

working on explosive phase
vertical: 35
weight: 206

Big 3: 300/440/515

Strength and growth come only through continuous effort and struggle.

I couldnt agree more. Doing all the right things all at once, you can see some amazing gains.

But seriously how often is that really going to happen? Most people are no where near the dedication level it takes to see significant gains in such a short period, theres just always something missing. And people on these boards is no exception, a lot of us are guilty of it.

Good program? check , Sleep? check, Diet? Terrible

Good program? No, sleep and diet? check

all that, no cardio?

See what I mean, theres always something most times.

So yeah significant gains in as little as 2 years is entirely possible, naturally of course.

Now in your case, if the charts are true then your gains are going to slow significantly. But I suppose its something you will find out in due time if its correct. It only makes sense you see the best gains with proper training at the beginning of your training career.

RollingStone


Id like to point out that I am almost right at my peak according to these calculators and it only took me two years.  Ive been very focused these 2 years though.  I guess Im trying to say that it is possible to make alot of progress in a short time if you go all out.

6'3"  @213

Squat 1x20x275

press:200, Deadlift:475, Bench:300, P.clean:235, Squat:385

"The only failure that is final is to stop trying to improve"

Im not gonna stress about it.  Im pretty much where I wanna be anyway.  Id like maybe a little more arm but other than that I just wanna stay lean and gain alot of strength for my size.

I guess the dedication just comes from how important it is to you.  I was hooked the second I started.

working on explosive phase
vertical: 35
weight: 206

Big 3: 300/440/515

Strength and growth come only through continuous effort and struggle.

Marc,
    Question:  Does this mean these huge dudes who win contests and appear in the muscle mags have big wrists and ankles (genetic freak theory) or are all roided up (chemical theory).  Where do we look for appropriate role models in this sport?

JMBS


Marc,
    Question:  Does this mean these huge dudes who win contests and appear in the muscle mags have big wrists and ankles (genetic freak theory) or are all roided up (chemical theory).  Where do we look for appropriate role models in this sport?

Usually it's both... always roids...

I had the problem with no cardio for a while. then I got that but I let the diet slip and ate dirty.

Now I have a great program, following a diet well, got a good cardio regimine working for me, but for some reason I can't sleep anymore.

Marc, Question: Does this mean these huge dudes who win contests and appear in the muscle mags have big wrists and ankles (genetic freak theory) or are all roided up (chemical theory). Where do we look for appropriate role models in this sport?

What an absolutely brilliant question!

For the 1st part... more often than not.  Not all of them but it's damn hard to tell who's doing what.  Without proper testing.  Visually inspecting people and then knowing they are cheating is just too much of a stretch.  It's not worth the effort to think or worry about it.  Since I'm not going to be a pro bodybuilder, it doens't much matter to me personally.  What does is the impact it has on people who are new to the sport, young kids or false illusions of body image with people turning to drugs to try and acheive something they aren't much willing to work for in the first place.

Frankly, I don't follow the pros.  I don't watch, read about or care what IFBB and other bodybuilders do.  I see pictures for entertainment but that's the extent of it.

For the 2nd part.. you find role models in natural bodybuilding shows that are tested.  You find them here in DB like the avatar above you.. RollingStone.  You find them from people who teach, not preach and rant, who show leadership skills.  You find role models who win tested shows, who show extremely hard work ethics and focus on nutrition and intense training.

None of my current role models come from professional, magazine sponsored, supplement company sponsored events.  I rarely find many good role models myself.  I find mentors, champions and coaches thru various readings and referrals from other experts in the field.

This sport in my opinion was ruined with the introduction of steroids.  It's taken a long, dark path from something of the Jack LaLanne days to today's monster freaks where there's no such thing as too much muscle.

I find role models few and far between but it's from personal contact and friend referrals.  I'll admit that they either come from Tom Ventuo's contacts or references (circle of friends) or from people on DB who I have meet like Scott Hults and Linda Cusmano.

In my opinion it's better to have no role models other than yourself than to pick role models that say one thing and do another.

What a fantastic question.  I'm going to write this one down.  I think it's more complex and more detailed that what I've written here.

Marc C. David - NGA CPT
Author of NoBull Bodybuilding
www.nobullbodybuilding.com

Dont mean to brag but Ive blown past even the highest numbered charts on there at this point.  6' says 206lbs @ 10% bf and im around 210 carb depleted at 7%ish at 6'0" 

So yeah, aim high.

working on explosive phase
vertical: 35
weight: 206

Big 3: 300/440/515

Strength and growth come only through continuous effort and struggle.

I remember when Marc first posted this, Back then I was getting very close to one full year of proper weight training, and now im pushing into 1.5 years in a few months.

I fall into that category of, a few years of poor training prior to my serious training run. I was never consistent about it, be it due to injuries or whatever else.

Over the first serious year I probably did manage to put on 15-20 or so pounds of LBM, along with a fair amount of fat. I think when I first found DBB.com, was when I seperated my shoulder and all I could do was cardio I dropped down to about 175 lb's @ about 12% BF. So clearly I didnt have much LBM on my frame. In my defense I did lose a good amount for being out of the gym for about 7 months. But considering where im at now, 213 @ 11ish %. Ill have to try to get a good picture, I am starting to see some ab outlines much easier...lol.

** ( I just re-read that...doesnt make much sense numbers wise, TBH I wish I knew my BF numbers back then but I do know I was 175 for a few months because all I did was cardio due to the injury. I dont know how much LBM I have put on since then, but guessing numbers looks goofy so disregard it, lol), I will say though that either I put on more muscle over those poor years of training, or I am doing something really good since I did start training serious because according to the charts I seem way to close to my "genetic potential"**

Anyway, I still got a ways to go, My ideal body weight @ 10% is 218 lb's. Not too terribly far off though. However, right now I will be aiming to get down to at least 8%.

I will most certainly aim to surpass the numbers predicted as Im sure anyone would. But I think this serves an important purpose, in that it gives you a realistic bar to set for yourself and hopefully will ultimately reach and go further with it.

It was definitely cool seeing this again after awhile.  

6'3"  @213

Squat 1x20x275

press:200, Deadlift:475, Bench:300, P.clean:235, Squat:385

"The only failure that is final is to stop trying to improve"

does this mean when i reach 189 lbs at 10 percent body fat i am at my greatest performance capability? does this also mean i cant get stronger? or can you get stronger just not bigger? I am interested to know because im at 185lbs at roughly 10 percent body fat...thats not alot go LBM to gain.

Height = 5'9
11/01/09...11/12/09...06/19/10
Weight = 184...186...195   
B.Squat = 315...365...435
Deadlift = 385...405...455
Cleans = 155...175...275
Bench = 245...255...335

sw0le


does this mean when i reach 189 lbs at 10 percent body fat i am at my greatest performance capability? does this also mean i cant get stronger? or can you get stronger just not bigger? I am interested to know because im at 185lbs at roughly 10 percent body fat...thats not alot go LBM to gain.

working on explosive phase
vertical: 35
weight: 206

Big 3: 300/440/515

Strength and growth come only through continuous effort and struggle.

RollingStone

sw0le


does this mean when i reach 189 lbs at 10 percent body fat i am at my greatest performance capability? does this also mean i cant get stronger? or can you get stronger just not bigger? I am interested to know because im at 185lbs at roughly 10 percent body fat...thats not alot go LBM to gain.

was this supposed to help me in getting an answer lol im slow and simple =]

Height = 5'9
11/01/09...11/12/09...06/19/10
Weight = 184...186...195   
B.Squat = 315...365...435
Deadlift = 385...405...455
Cleans = 155...175...275
Bench = 245...255...335

Think of it as just guidlines and realistic goals.

If your already at your predicted weight then my guess is you have been training for a good amount of time and im sure you will still gain some. This is all naturally too, and there is always exceptions to the rules. So your gains may be slow especially compared to when you first started, but dont think of it as, this is it kind of thing.

Of course you can still get stronger

6'3"  @213

Squat 1x20x275

press:200, Deadlift:475, Bench:300, P.clean:235, Squat:385

"The only failure that is final is to stop trying to improve"

sw0le

RollingStone

sw0le


does this mean when i reach 189 lbs at 10 percent body fat i am at my greatest performance capability? does this also mean i cant get stronger? or can you get stronger just not bigger? I am interested to know because im at 185lbs at roughly 10 percent body fat...thats not alot go LBM to gain.

was this supposed to help me in getting an answer lol im slow and simple =]

yeah but it was addressed probably 5-6 times in this same thread.

working on explosive phase
vertical: 35
weight: 206

Big 3: 300/440/515

Strength and growth come only through continuous effort and struggle.