T-Bomb, nordiol, or mag-10?
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T-Bomb, nordiol, or mag-10? - 10/17/2003 3:31:51 PM
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TXAggie
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Hello,
Ok I have decided to go the pH route and have narrowed my choices down to the following:
T-Bomb (Basic oral 1-test)
Nordiol (made by Muscletech)
Mag-10 (1-test and 4-AD)
1-AD (by Ergopharm)
Are there better alternatives out there? Yes, probably, such as an Avant Labs transdermal, but I don't get those for free whereas I do get the above for free :) Thus my choices are limited to those above (plus some other crappy ones I narrowed these down from).
So here's the deal: I want to gain mass, mostly LBM, as much as possible, but WITHOUT any DHT side effects. My father lost his hair pretty young and even though I haven't started losing mine yet, it might very well happen in the next few years.
I have heard nordiol is the best with this and to take saw palmetto with it but I have also heard (unfortunately from the Mag-10 website) that Mag-10 has almost no DHT or estrogen side effects. If this is true I would probably rather go with that.
So does anyone have any similar experiences? Any advice?
Thanks a ton,
Bryan
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RE: T-Bomb, nordiol, or mag-10? - 10/17/2003 9:11:26 PM
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TreeTrunks
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I've tried mag-10. I really liked it. Of course I followed there "plan for sucess" which i'd recommend. Overall I gained 25lbs. If I did it over again i'd use twicew the doseage, or 2 times a day. They say you could do it, but its expensive so I used 1 dose a day.
EDIT: For side effects, you'll be safe with 1-test, because it doesn't convert to DHT. Its considered safe.
< Message edited by TreeTrunks -- 10/17/2003 9:12:28 PM >
(in reply to TXAggie)
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RE: T-Bomb, nordiol, or mag-10? - 10/19/2003 1:04:45 PM
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TXAggie
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Thanks a ton for the response, I was hoping to hear some first hand experience with one of those.
Just curious though, where did you hear/read that 1-test doesn't convert to DHT? I've read that 1-AD does convert to DHT and can affect the hairline, and i know 1-ad converts directly to 1-test. I hope that what you say is true though, i would love to start a cycle of 1-test, based on all the excellent feedback I've seen with it. Do you have any links to articles or anything showing 1-test doesn't convert to DHT? or maybe twinpeak, if you"re there, do you know for certain the answer to this?
P.S.-Was that 25 lbs of mostly muscle? Also, what does their "plan for success" entail?
Thanks again,
bryan
(in reply to TXAggie)
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RE: T-Bomb, nordiol, or mag-10? - 10/19/2003 5:35:24 PM
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Twin Peak
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****, if its for free, stock up on 1-AD and 6-oxo and high dose each, in 4 week intervals.
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(in reply to TXAggie)
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RE: T-Bomb, nordiol, or mag-10? - 10/19/2003 6:11:25 PM
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TXAggie
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Well yes, from what I have seen 1-AD is the most effective out of those however I was concerned about the possible side effects, namely hair loss (DHT coversion). Do you have any idea how harsh 1-AD (or 1-test) is on the hairline, TP?
I would really prefer to use 1-AD as the nordiol my friend carries is utter crap (muscletech) but again, just really afraid of any sides.
Also I dont get 6-oxo for free... do you think its really that much better over something like a tribulus/isoflavone mix for post cycle therapy?
Thanks,
Bryan
(in reply to TXAggie)
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RE: T-Bomb, nordiol, or mag-10? - 10/20/2003 6:30:06 AM
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Twin Peak
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Trib is a waste of money and time, as it dose crap, except perhaps help thye libido. Get 6-oxo, just don't run it as high as you would if it were free. 3-400 mg a day for half the length of the cycle should be fine.
Yes, 1-ad and 1-test could be tough on the hairline. It hasn't effected mine at all, though.
Nor didn't do jack for me, save possibly cause some gyno. And any musctletech PH ain't worth the bottle it comes in.
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(in reply to TXAggie)
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RE: T-Bomb, nordiol, or mag-10? - 10/20/2003 12:12:10 PM
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TXAggie
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hmm.... I have also considered selling what I get on ebay and using the proceeds to purchase some norspray from avant that I've seen on 1fast400... it seems to have received good ratings on there.
Was the nor you used a spray from avant and was it nordiol? I'm pretty sure nordiol doesn't convert to estrogen.
Thanks,
Bryan
(in reply to Twin Peak)
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RE: T-Bomb, nordiol, or mag-10? - 10/20/2003 12:18:09 PM
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Twin Peak
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You are confused.
Nor-diol is short for a compound Nor-androstendiol. It is the active ingredient in any Nor product including Avant's old Nor-Aderm.
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(in reply to TXAggie)
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RE: T-Bomb, nordiol, or mag-10? - 10/20/2003 1:59:15 PM
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TXAggie
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No not confused, just miscommuncated. You said the product you took increased your estrogen level (gave you gyno), and I was wondering if it was a nordiol or the old norandro because from what I have seen, nordiol doesn't convert to estrogen and thus should not give gyno under any circumstances.
Was the product you tried the old avant Noraderm? I am now seriously considering trying that out. Also, is it still of the same quality, even though it is now made by dermabolics? heard any good/bad about it?
Thanks a ton,
Bryan
(in reply to Twin Peak)
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RE: T-Bomb, nordiol, or mag-10? - 10/20/2003 2:09:45 PM
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Twin Peak
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Yes, it was Nor-aderm. When you say "old", there has only been one.
The dermabolics is the exact same formula without carbomer (which gives it the gel-like consistency).
Any nor product will have the same effects, I think my dosage was just too high.
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(in reply to TXAggie)
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RE: T-Bomb, nordiol, or mag-10? - 10/22/2003 8:13:55 AM
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TreeTrunks
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Tx, The "plan for success" uses mag-10 for 2 weeks, followed by using Tribex500 and M (natural test booster and anti-estrogen respectively). You use the Tribex 500 and M for post cycle. And you can do multiple back to back cycles of the stuff.
Twin, i'll have to sorta disagree with you on your trib comment. For the most part trib is junk but Tribex was awesome! I really noticed its effects. Increased libido=increased test.
(in reply to Twin Peak)
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RE: T-Bomb, nordiol, or mag-10? - 10/22/2003 8:23:17 AM
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Twin Peak
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quote:
ORIGINAL: TreeTrunks
Increased libido=increased test.
This is a baseless statement. Yohimbine raises libido and has no effect on test levels. Just like trib.
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(in reply to TreeTrunks)
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RE: T-Bomb, nordiol, or mag-10? - 10/22/2003 10:02:13 AM
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TreeTrunks
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Twin Peak
quote:
ORIGINAL: TreeTrunks
Increased libido=increased test.
This is a baseless statement. Yohimbine raises libido and has no effect on test levels. Just like trib.
I refer you to this thread, http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/1%2Dtestosterone/m_5035/tm.htm
No libido, no test. hmmmmm i'd say correlation is for causation.
(in reply to Twin Peak)
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RE: T-Bomb, nordiol, or mag-10? - 10/22/2003 10:31:30 AM
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Twin Peak
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That really is an ignornant post. Correlation does not equal causation. At least not in the world of science.
Because decreased test can cause a decrease in libido does not mean that it is the ONLY cause of decreased libido.
< Message edited by Twin Peak -- 10/22/2003 10:39:47 AM >
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(in reply to TreeTrunks)
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RE: T-Bomb, nordiol, or mag-10? - 10/22/2003 11:16:09 AM
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TreeTrunks
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Not the ONLY but there is a Correlation. Let me help ya out:
cor·re·la·tion ( P ) Pronunciation Key (kôr-lshn, kr-)
n.
A causal, complementary, parallel, or reciprocal relationship, especially a structural, functional, or qualitative correspondence between two comparable entities: a correlation between drug abuse and crime.
Statistics. The simultaneous change in value of two numerically valued random variables: the positive correlation between cigarette smoking and the incidence of lung cancer; the negative correlation between age and normal vision.
An act of correlating or the condition of being correlated.
Anyways, show me a study showing where a person with a low libido had high test. levels. I've even read where doctors administer test. injections for women to increase there libidos. And what about young boys goign through puberty? Remember puberty? Show me that study and i'll believe you. Until then logic must be applied.
< Message edited by TreeTrunks -- 10/22/2003 11:23:35 AM >
(in reply to Twin Peak)
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RE: T-Bomb, nordiol, or mag-10? - 10/22/2003 11:25:22 AM
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Twin Peak
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Statistics show that when the tempeture rises, so does the amount of human ice cream consumption.
Does this mean that when human ice cream consumption rises, the tempature must also rise?
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(in reply to TreeTrunks)
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RE: T-Bomb, nordiol, or mag-10? - 10/22/2003 12:19:33 PM
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TreeTrunks
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*Waiting for study from Twin Peak*
I don't see how one can affect the weather simply by eating ice cream. Irrelavant. Although, personally, i Like 'If I sleep in a garage, does that make me a car?'
So I will continue to wait for your scientific evidence to prove logic wrong. Until I see some scientic evidence that says the contrary I have to go off of logic. Which I know logic doesn't always hold in the scientific world, but it has to suffice until evidence of the contrary. Thats all I have to go on.
< Message edited by TreeTrunks -- 10/22/2003 12:22:45 PM >
(in reply to Marc David)
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RE: T-Bomb, nordiol, or mag-10? - 10/22/2003 12:34:25 PM
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Twin Peak
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Its not irrlevant. You are making false assumptions that because trib increases libido (as does Yohimbine, oysters, etc) it MUST increase test levels.
It don't.
If you want to claim trib increases test levels you are the one who shoudl be stepping up with a study buster.
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(in reply to TreeTrunks)
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RE: T-Bomb, nordiol, or mag-10? - 10/22/2003 3:06:44 PM
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TreeTrunks
Posts: 92
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Twin Peak
If you want to claim trib increases test levels you are the one who shoudl be stepping up with a study buster.
Re-Read "buster"
quote:
So I will continue to wait for your scientific evidence to prove logic wrong. Until I see some scientic evidence that says the contrary I have to go off of logic. Which I know logic doesn't always hold in the scientific world, but it has to suffice until evidence of the contrary. Thats all I have to go on.
(in reply to Twin Peak)
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