Stack... advice?
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Stack... advice? - 4/3/2008 1:24:05 PM
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cwa2008
Posts: 8
Joined: 4/3/2008
Status: offline
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Hey there, im a new member (obviously.) I was trying to do some research on supplements and there seems to be a lot of people on here who really know and care about this sort of thing, so I figured you guys would be able to help me out.
I've been taking creatine on and off since i was around 15 (which is another story) but I've been trying something new lately.
I heard from an older gentlemen I met about what he used to take in college which, instead of all the expensive creatines and whatnot, was just purely vitamins. He claimed that the mix of the vitamins would increase your testosterone levels, not by increasing production, but by allowing your body to work 100%. I'm not sure as to his credibility, but I figured vitamins are good for you anyway.
The stack includes:
A - 10,000
B12 - 5,000
C - 1,000
E - 1,000
Zinc - 1,000
Manganese - 5.0
Taken 5 days on and 2 days off. According to the guy it "builds up in your body."
I looked into it and to purchase all of these vitamins from the local GNC was only around $30.00 for a 3 month supply, and I got my friend to split the bottles and the price with me, to lower the amount lost if the product was a fluke. The very first day I could notice a difference (which is most likely caused by the b12, which gets you pumped as hell) and, honest to god, I was having times when I would want to beat someone's ass, and there were times when I couldn't stop thinking about girls... I mean everybody gets a little bit excited every now and then but I think you know what I mean. It wasn't just me, my friend was having similiar effects as well.
I tried googling any mention of a stack similiar to this and the only thing that I could find was the fact that GNC's Mega Mens Sport had every one of these ingredients, but roughly 10-25 percent of what I was taking. Also, there are some brand name "Testosterone Boosters/Enhancers" that include all of these vitamins as well as some various amino acids.
I was skeptical at first, but I did see results. My bench max shot up about 40 (over the course of about 5 weeks) lb for the one rep... It seemed like I just kept throwing more and more weight on the bar, and I even had to go buy more weight for my home gym. A few of the guys from work went out and bought the stack for themselves when they saw the results that I was getting.
I haven't run into any side effects of it yet (other than those mentioned above) but my main concern is purely health. My 18th birthday was just yesterday, and I'm still in High School. I'm stacking the vitamins with Size-On and Wheybolic 60... im 6'0 and 175 lb. Squat is around 300 (haven't done it in a while... hurt my lower back a few years ago.) Bench as of last week is rated at 295 on the conversion chart.
I mean I really like all the things that I'm taking but... is it safe? I've heard terrible stories about people messing with their testosterone levels and having side effects that stay with them for the rest of their lives. I love being jacked up all day and I love the results, but it isn't worth messing up my natural development.
While I honestly believe that the vitamins have something to do with it, I am taking into consideration the motivation that I got from seeing results as well as my other supplements. One thing that bothers me is that I don't really "feel it" any more when I take them..
Unrelated question: When you take a new type of creatine or a pre-workout formula (as in, a different brand from your previous) do you begin to see the effects plateau around the end of the bottle? I've had some experience with that and usually when I change brands I start making better gains again.
As for the vitamins: After failing to find any other source of information on this other than the testimonial of a near stranger, I was hoping that the members of this forum could shed some light on this issue and possibly quell some of the doubts that I'm beginning to have. This is something that really is starting to bother me and I would appreciate any feedback or information that you could provide.
Thanks,
Chris
P.S. I have not noticed any side-effects other than the mood changes... no testicular shrinkage, hair loss, or increased acne or anything.
What do you guys think?
< Message edited by cwa2008 -- 4/3/2008 1:26:22 PM >
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RE: Stack... advice? - 4/3/2008 1:36:33 PM
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odw777
Posts: 1909
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline
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Megadosing on vitamins is not the best idea. For fat soluble vitamins and minerals stick to the recommended dosages. For water soluble vitamins like B vitamins you could take a whole lot, but it'll just get dumped in your urine.
I've read some studies that showed huge doses of vitamin c helped oxidize fat, but those were given through injection.
You're going to have some serious problems if you try taking 1g of zinc a day. Stick to 25mg-50mg. Anymore is not going to give you any more testosterone.
You were probobly zinc deficient, or you're just seeing a placebo effect.
(in reply to cwa2008)
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RE: Stack... advice? - 4/3/2008 1:44:22 PM
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cwa2008
Posts: 8
Joined: 4/3/2008
Status: offline
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Sorry - to clarify:
A - 10,000 iu
B12 - 5000 mcg
C - 1000 mg
E - 1000 iu
Zinc - 100 mg
Manganese - 5 mg
I'm not going to deny that the placebo effect is possible, I know that I have lifted harder and been more motivated than ever, as we all are when we are excited to see results.
I wouldn't necessarily call these vitamin "megadosing" I mean you can buy them right on the counter.. so could something like that be harmful? I find it hard to believe, but at the same time I just want to get someone's opinion who is more knowledgable.
(in reply to odw777)
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RE: Stack... advice? - 4/3/2008 3:15:40 PM
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RedJeep
Posts: 648
Joined: 4/19/2007
From: USandA
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: odw777
Megadosing on vitamins is not the best idea. For fat soluble vitamins and minerals stick to the recommended dosages. For water soluble vitamins like B vitamins you could take a whole lot, but it'll just get dumped in your urine.
I've read some studies that showed huge doses of vitamin c helped oxidize fat, but those were given through injection.
You're going to have some serious problems if you try taking 1g of zinc a day. Stick to 25mg-50mg. Anymore is not going to give you any more testosterone.
You were probobly zinc deficient, or you're just seeing a placebo effect.
x2
Zinc in that high amount could be harmful overtime. Side effects from overdosing vitamins will take a while to show up because your body is pretty good about disposing excess vitamins, I would get a good multivitamin and keep training hard or take what you have in more reasonable amounts. The increase in energy is definetely from the b-12. If you never took vitamins before than you were probably deficient in a few of those. You mentioned your bench going up, how long have you been training for?
_____________________________
Age: 20
Height: 5'11
Currently: Cutting
Stack:Animal (Pak,Pump,M-stak, flex), Whey, Xtend.
(in reply to odw777)
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RE: Stack... advice? - 4/4/2008 9:59:15 AM
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cwa2008
Posts: 8
Joined: 4/3/2008
Status: offline
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I've been training for some time now... Basically since I was about 15. And about the deficiency, you may very well be correct. Like I said, the results that I seemed to get from this cocktail may have been influenced by other sources. Again, my major concern is health. If no one here can tell me a significant reason to change my choice of supplements, then I am happy with that.
And if you didn't read my earlier post, I was combining this is size on from gaspari as well as some gmc proteins
(in reply to RedJeep)
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RE: Stack... advice? - 4/4/2008 11:20:19 AM
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RedJeep
Posts: 648
Joined: 4/19/2007
From: USandA
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cwa2008
I've been training for some time now... Basically since I was about 15. And about the deficiency, you may very well be correct. Like I said, the results that I seemed to get from this cocktail may have been influenced by other sources. Again, my major concern is health. If no one here can tell me a significant reason to change my choice of supplements, then I am happy with that.
And if you didn't read my earlier post, I was combining this is size on from gaspari as well as some gmc proteins
lol, we did tell you, its your body, do what you want.
_____________________________
Age: 20
Height: 5'11
Currently: Cutting
Stack:Animal (Pak,Pump,M-stak, flex), Whey, Xtend.
(in reply to cwa2008)
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RE: Stack... advice? - 4/4/2008 12:03:07 PM
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aolson
Posts: 576
Joined: 4/5/2007
From: Withee, Wisconsin
Status: offline
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i have a question, does b12 really get u jacked up and do u ever get used to it over time? can i combine this with my superpump and a thermogenic?
_____________________________
BALLIN'
get JACKED!
(in reply to RedJeep)
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RE: Stack... advice? - 4/5/2008 12:59:43 AM
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cwa2008
Posts: 8
Joined: 4/3/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: RedJeep
quote:
ORIGINAL: cwa2008
I've been training for some time now... Basically since I was about 15. And about the deficiency, you may very well be correct. Like I said, the results that I seemed to get from this cocktail may have been influenced by other sources. Again, my major concern is health. If no one here can tell me a significant reason to change my choice of supplements, then I am happy with that.
And if you didn't read my earlier post, I was combining this is size on from gaspari as well as some gmc proteins
lol, we did tell you, its your body, do what you want.
From the answers I recieved, and didn't recieve, I've concluded that the side effects associated with what I thought was some sort of testosterone-alteration are most likely due to the placebo effect... which was my main area for concern. True?
(in reply to RedJeep)
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