Question about carbs...

Why does everyone on here hate on them so much? Granted there are bad carbs, ie sugars, starches etc. BUt there is absolutely nothing wrong with oatmeal, sweet potatos, brown rice, whole wheats and whole grains.
 
Carbs dont make you fat, poor diet and excess calories do.

because many people here are stuck on a gimmick and do not understand, or want to bother to learn how to eat well.... although the gimmick works well, too many people think it is the way to eat,( instead of a quick fix temporary fat cutting diet, or pre contest diet which is actually the best use of severe carb manipulation), and that is so wrong...

No carbs don't make you fat, but manipulating how many you intake each day does significantly affect the way you look.  I don't fully understand it all yet, but I look very cut when I'm carb depleted, and i look full and thick when I'm not...

"True genius, in many fields of human endeavor, is often revealed in elegant simplicity."

- A smart man

Journal: http://www.wannabebigforums.com/showthread.php?t=117358

that is because you dehydrated!!!!!

Nobody hates carbs.  They're just not optimal if you're cutting.  Carbs have their place and you're not gonna build muscle without them.

thehardway


that is because you dehydrated!!!!!

Not necessarily.  Carbs store water, cutting out carbs make you look more lean because your body isn't storing as much, that doesn't mean you're dehydrated.  As long as you consume ample amounts of water you're fine.

Look down and me and you'll see a fool.  Look up at me and you'll see your Lord.  Look straight at me and you'll see yourself.

My biggest concern with low carb diets would be the effect years down the road.I'm not going to knock the diets cause i simply haven't researched or tried any of them.But i do understand the importance of fruits,veggies and grains daily for overall health.I personally want to look good but also live longer.

carbs are a MUST to put on muscle...

dont be fooled Insulin = the most anabolic hormone

YOU GOTTA EAT BIG, TO BE BIG!!

NASM certified trainer
NFPT certified trainer

Winter Bulk goal:245-250 by dec 31 - Achieved
Current weight: 246

Creation


carbs are a MUST to put on muscle...

dont be fooled Insulin = the most anabolic hormone

yeah but no one is disputing this.  Just saying.

Who says carbs arent optimal when cutting? I would venture to guarantee that none of you lift as hard or train as well when cutting carbs.
I've noticed from reading on here that the FAD keto diet seems to be real popular....why? Its nothing special.

If you want to cut, then cut your total calories, or burn more than you take in, while eating a CLEAN diet.

Dont be fooled by fads people.

bringtherain3:16


Who says carbs arent optimal when cutting? I would venture to guarantee that none of you lift as hard or train as well when cutting carbs.
I've noticed from reading on here that the FAD keto diet seems to be real popular....why? Its nothing special.

If you want to cut, then cut your total calories, or burn more than you take in, while eating a CLEAN diet.

Dont be fooled by fads people.

wow. that's totally revolutionary. you are a pioneer. master of your domain.

bringtherain3:16


Who says carbs arent optimal when cutting? I would venture to guarantee that none of you lift as hard or train as well when cutting carbs.
I've noticed from reading on here that the FAD keto diet seems to be real popular....why? Its nothing special.

If you want to cut, then cut your total calories, or burn more than you take in, while eating a CLEAN diet.

Dont be fooled by fads people.

sorry.  Ive done both.  I lift waaay harder without carbs and have way more energy and focus without having constant appetite and hunger associated with low calorie carbohydrate diets.  Ask many others too.  You can lift hard on keto.  The muscle sparing effects keep you strong too.  I gained tons of strength and muscle while on it.

Keto is the only effective cut.

Its not a fad.  You're somebody with no cred who is probably another member of this board afraid to post under their own name.  Why would you come in here and on your first post bash keto.  It's science.  You fail.

RollingStone

bringtherain3:16


Who says carbs arent optimal when cutting? I would venture to guarantee that none of you lift as hard or train as well when cutting carbs.
I've noticed from reading on here that the FAD keto diet seems to be real popular....why? Its nothing special.

If you want to cut, then cut your total calories, or burn more than you take in, while eating a CLEAN diet.

Dont be fooled by fads people.

sorry.  Ive done both.  I lift waaay harder without carbs and have way more energy and focus without having constant appetite and hunger associated with low calorie carbohydrate diets.  Ask many others too.  You can lift hard on keto.  The muscle sparing effects keep you strong too.  I gained tons of strength and muscle while on it.

Keto is the only effective cut.

Its not a fad.  You're somebody with no cred who is probably another member of this board afraid to post under their own name.  Why would you come in here and on your first post bash keto.  It's science.  I fail.

Show me the science then.... oh and i fixed your last sentence... ur welcome

Oh and the harway is right... people found this as a solution to attempt to cut and not have to eat clean because they have no self-control

bringtherain3:16


Oh and the harway is right... people found this as a solution to attempt to cut and not have to eat clean because they have no self-control

Haha is that why?  Its about macros man.  If people wanna eat bacon and sausage thats their decision.

Fact is it works.  And it works a hell of a lot better than any other cut.  Im tired of putting up the same arguments against people saying the same ignorant things.  I can almost guarantee you've never done a ckd first of all.  Only reasons I can see that you are so against it is either

you made some diet program that was selling good until people started obtaining more information or
you went to school and studied this type of thing and only understand carbohydrate metabolism and what theyve taught you

There have been long debate threads about keto already where people put out real concerns about the long term effects of keto though we dont actually know about them at this point.

The things you are saying though are just wrong.

Bottom line.  Do what works for you.  But dont put out false information.

RollingStone

bringtherain3:16


Who says carbs arent optimal when cutting? I would venture to guarantee that none of you lift as hard or train as well when cutting carbs.
I've noticed from reading on here that the FAD keto diet seems to be real popular....why? Its nothing special.

If you want to cut, then cut your total calories, or burn more than you take in, while eating a CLEAN diet.

Dont be fooled by fads people.

sorry.  Ive done both.  I lift waaay harder without carbs and have way more energy and focus without having constant appetite and hunger associated with low calorie carbohydrate diets.  Ask many others too.  You can lift hard on keto.  The muscle sparing effects keep you strong too.  I gained tons of strength and muscle while on it.

Keto is the only effective cut.

Its not a fad.  You're somebody with no cred who is probably another member of this board afraid to post under their own name.  Why would you come in here and on your first post bash keto.  It's science.  You fail.

RS.....Maybe you have to lift harder without the carbs????
I'm asking,not disputing....I know nothing about KETO....or any other diet for that matter,well,as far as working knowledge anyhow, As I'm a skinny bastard and can eat for days without gaining an ounce.
But was just wondering...is there a noticeable difference between lifting with and without (carbs)?

Current Stack: HDROL,Celltech,Superpump 250, Glutamine,Beta alanine,Whey protein.

I have better energy on keto and therefore my workouts are better.  It's something you would have to experience.  You may not get the same strength gains on keto as a regular diet with a large caloric excess but the energy to workout is definately better in my experience.

And when on a caloric deficit in a carb metabolism youll feel run down during your workouts because your main energy source (carbs) are being restricted.  This is usually solved by cycling carbohydrates and eating more before the workout but that leaves you feeling tired and lethargic with crashes later when you aren't eating them.

Ive dieted both ways multiple times and I lost strength on carbs, gained strength on keto.

Nothing beats excess calories and carbs for strength but for a balance between some strength/muscle gain while losing fat, keto is better.

Thanks RS
That Explains a lot!!!

Current Stack: HDROL,Celltech,Superpump 250, Glutamine,Beta alanine,Whey protein.

bringtherain3:16


Oh and the harway is right... people found this as a solution to attempt to cut and not have to eat clean because they have no self-control

How long have you been lurking here before you decided to join and start this thread?

I agree with you in terms of oatmeal, sweet potatoes, etc being good for bulking. When cutting though, a low carb approach is the best, especially for folks like me - endomorphs.

I have mixed feelings regarding this topic, because When I did cut I dropped carbs a lot (along with total intake) and kept them to early on in the day.

I was going to try keto, just at the temptation I know how carb sensitive I can be. I certainly wouldnt try it because I am "lazy" with my diet. But I also think it can be done just as effectively similar to what the OP is saying. I wont lie either, seeing RS's pics makes me want to try it. But I know my own body too, I do not do well strength wise with drastically low carb.

I probably do fall into the category of the OP, as in if I were to intentionally cut right now I would simply drop my intake, but also drop the carbs a good amount. Still getting in good carbs early on and fast carbs P/W.

anyway not much of an input, but I like reading both sides.

6'2" @205
press:200, Deadlift:475, Bench:300, P.clean:235, Squat:385
www.Nikdesigns.com

bringtherain3:16

people found this as a solution to attempt to cut and not have to eat clean because they have no self-control

Maybe for some.  I've read some threads with a lot of people who just like to brag about all the gross stuff they can eat.  But that's not everyone.  You can maintain a pretty healthy diet on keto, it's not inherently "unclean" just because of the high fat content.

Plus, a lot of people who use keto to cut love carbs and display quite a lot of self control by cutting them out.  

This is just another ill-conceived post by someone who hasn't tried the diet and doesn't even understand the funtamentals behind it.

/yawn

snatchula

bringtherain3:16

people found this as a solution to attempt to cut and not have to eat clean because they have no self-control

Maybe for some.  I've read some threads with a lot of people who just like to brag about all the gross stuff they can eat.  But that's not everyone.  You can maintain a pretty healthy diet on keto, it's not inherently "unclean" just because of the high fat content.

Plus, a lot of people who use keto to cut love carbs and display quite a lot of self control by cutting them out.  

This is just another ill-conceived post by someone who hasn't tried the diet and doesn't even understand the funtamentals behind it.

/yawn

x 2

good post man

Nm0ney34


I have mixed feelings regarding this topic, because When I did cut I dropped carbs a lot (along with total intake) and kept them to early on in the day.

I was going to try keto, just at the temptation I know how carb sensitive I can be. I certainly wouldnt try it because I am "lazy" with my diet. But I also think it can be done just as effectively similar to what the OP is saying. I wont lie either, seeing RS's pics makes me want to try it. But I know my own body too, I do not do well strength wise with drastically low carb.

I probably do fall into the category of the OP, as in if I were to intentionally cut right now I would simply drop my intake, but also drop the carbs a good amount. Still getting in good carbs early on and fast carbs P/W.

anyway not much of an input, but I like reading both sides.

Come on now... You of all people should know rolling stone has always been that cut, or damn close to it!!!! You have been around here long enough.


But some one like you with your experience, diet and training, are the exact type whom,  if getting really cut becomes your primary goal, could benefit from giving CDK a whorl...

Rolling Stone I have to ask, when is the last time you have eaten Carbs "normally"

No, all of the really cut up pictures youve seen of me are while carb depleted...I mean Ive always been cut by a regular persons standards but Im only shredded when Im doing low carb.  Even last year when I didnt know of keto I was still doing no carb, just without carb loads...hence why I lost a bit of mass last summer.

I went back on keto three weeks ago so I was doing regular for about a month before that.  It fxcking sucked.

lol I know, but like I said its like one of those things where I see and im like damn I wanna look that cut! Then I realize I dont want to cut down that low just yet, and yes he has always been freakishly cut :P

I still dont know if I would want to try it. I really really enjoy strength training, and when im too low on carbs it really effects me. Last time I cut I kept carbs to around 100g usually less more like 80. It usually became less carbs the lower I got.

I really like dans post, I wish I had a link, he talks about progressively lower calories along with progressively lowering/raising carbs protein and fats as your cutting.

thehardway

Nm0ney34


I have mixed feelings regarding this topic, because When I did cut I dropped carbs a lot (along with total intake) and kept them to early on in the day.

I was going to try keto, just at the temptation I know how carb sensitive I can be. I certainly wouldnt try it because I am "lazy" with my diet. But I also think it can be done just as effectively similar to what the OP is saying. I wont lie either, seeing RS's pics makes me want to try it. But I know my own body too, I do not do well strength wise with drastically low carb.

I probably do fall into the category of the OP, as in if I were to intentionally cut right now I would simply drop my intake, but also drop the carbs a good amount. Still getting in good carbs early on and fast carbs P/W.

anyway not much of an input, but I like reading both sides.

Come on now... You of all people should know rolling stone has always been that cut, or damn close to it!!!! You have been around here long enough.


But some one like you with your experience, diet and training, are the exact type whom,  if getting really cut becomes your primary goal, could benefit from giving CDK a whorl...

6'2" @205
press:200, Deadlift:475, Bench:300, P.clean:235, Squat:385
www.Nikdesigns.com

I lost a lot of strength doing the Keto cut... I know, incongruous to your goals... I need cabs to gain strength as well.

i was just mentioning that because, the only posting i do about Keto anymore is too argue against it, which is not really my perspective. I tend to disagree with the way it is being promoted as the only way to do a cut, or live, for that matter.

But i do believe it is a useful tool, for really specific goals, in the short term.. and some people have the control, and understanding of their body and how to eat, to do it well, and healthfully, you being one of those people.

But the taper down, carb manipulation, progression, is also an excellent way to go... no doubt.

Nm0ney34


lol I know, but like I said its like one of those things where I see and im like damn I wanna look that cut! Then I realize I dont want to cut down that low just yet, and yes he has always been freakishly cut :P

I still dont know if I would want to try it. I really really enjoy strength training, and when im too low on carbs it really effects me. Last time I cut I kept carbs to around 100g usually less more like 80. It usually became less carbs the lower I got.

I really like dans post, I wish I had a link, he talks about progressively lower calories along with progressively lowering/raising carbs protein and fats as your cutting.

Thats not the same thing.  Thats a carb diet low in carbs.  Youre restricting your main energy source of course youre gonna get weaker...

thehardway


I lost a lot of strength doing the Keto cut... I know, incongruous to your goals... I need cabs to gain strength as well.

i was just mentioning that because, the only posting i do about Keto anymore is too argue against it, which is not really my perspective. I tend to disagree with the way it is being promoted as the only way to do a cut, or live, for that matter.

But i do believe it is a useful tool, for really specific goals, in the short term.. and some people have the control, and understanding of their body and how to eat, to do it well, and healthfully, you being one of those people.

But the taper down, carb manipulation, progression, is also an excellent way to go... no doubt.

 
When someone posts question about losing fat and they really want the knowledge and really want to make an effort I want to give them the best answer I can thats gonna give them the most results.  I could be like yeah you need a caloric deficit such and such but then theyll just end up like me cutting my first time because thats all I was told.  I lost a ton of mass, lifts went way down and I got really frustrated - ended up doing 2-3 bulk/cut cycles within 2 months because I couldnt make up my mind because cutting wasnt working.  It is the best way to cut.  That's all there is to it, so why should I shortchange someone?
 
With all of the arguing Ive been doing for it, it seems like Im trying to force everyone on this diet.  I really just want this information out there and dont want other people to listen to crap that other people like the recent poster (rainman or somethin?) spit.  If I couldve known this stuff now when I was 17, I wouldv'e saved a lot of time.

I wasnt referencing it as the same thing, I was just explaining what I did. I lowered my total intake and carbs.

I cant imagine my body staying strong and progressing strength wise while on keto, I understand the basic concept. extremely low carb days and a recarb day. I would be more inclined to try carb cycling.

But im sure I will give it a try in the future.

RollingStone

Nm0ney34


lol I know, but like I said its like one of those things where I see and im like damn I wanna look that cut! Then I realize I dont want to cut down that low just yet, and yes he has always been freakishly cut :P

I still dont know if I would want to try it. I really really enjoy strength training, and when im too low on carbs it really effects me. Last time I cut I kept carbs to around 100g usually less more like 80. It usually became less carbs the lower I got.

I really like dans post, I wish I had a link, he talks about progressively lower calories along with progressively lowering/raising carbs protein and fats as your cutting.

Thats not the same thing.  Thats a carb diet low in carbs.  Youre restricting your main energy source of course youre gonna get weaker...

6'2" @205
press:200, Deadlift:475, Bench:300, P.clean:235, Squat:385
www.Nikdesigns.com