Massbuilding - *MB Part II pg. 16*

Thanks, I'll take a look at that.  I live near a Barnes & Noble.  I'll check that out. 
 
And yes... I am eager to learn.  I spend an hour or two a week just researching this kind of stuff.  I really want the best knowledge so I don't spend a year doing the wrong thing.  I spent my first month training doing that.  I wish I could have that month back.  But gotta move forward!

Started scrawny...

1/1/2006... 5'8" at 130 lbs

4/13/2006... 5'8" at 151 lbs

Progress is being made!

That's true. Patience and self belief are probably some of the most vital human components in bodybuilding, other than the body of course!!
 
You sound like the kind of guy who is hell bent on getting the body he deserves and thats a good thing.
 
Once you have the confidence in your programme and technique you're well on your way. Don't forget tp post some pics and keep us updated as you go...if you haven't already, join up with www.bodybuildingjournal.com its priceless for tracking your progress. When you can see your body changing, statistically in front of you, its a huge boost!

11.04.06:
Age: 22
Weight: 211 Lbs - 96 KG
Height: 6'
Body Fat: 22.13%

I LOVE LEG DAY!!

Murrdog:
 
That's good to hear that your looking forward to doing this routine sir. You will get your results do not worry, you will be suprised and not only you but people that know you as well.
 
Taking the week of isn't bad, it's good actually after battering yourself with weights for more then 12 weeks.
 
And again don't worry about it sir, just here to help and if anything else just let us know.
 
and just like what GLD1 has said just practice form and the start adding the weights, be patient and it will come.
 
Don't worry, it's always good to research, better to know as much information before going out in the field, wish I have used my 8-9 months  with this routine of time when I started working out but I'm proud of where I am right now and continue to move on, you will be proud yourself I'll gaurantee you
 
Goodluck and keep it up my friend!

Pure natural:
 
I decided to start a friend on this program.  He's new, we will see where he gets.
I think you know a suprising amount for working out less than a year.
 
Good advice.
 

Squat 385, Bench 235, Deadlift 450 @ 181.

ORIGINAL: Vario

Pure natural:

I decided to start a friend on this program.  He's new, we will see where he gets.
I think you know a suprising amount for working out less than a year.

Good advice.

Vario:

Hey what's up bud,

Sure not a problem get him started first understanding the routine, because some guys not all just scroll down and look at the exercises and judge it by how many exercises and splits there are and possibly saying it's undertraining which is something I did at first, anywways bud get him understandin how the routine works and if he has any questions I'd be gladly to help.

And yes i've had so much dissappointments my first 8-9 months of training, wish I got started on this routine earlier the fact that I'm doing this routine less then a year and already making gains.

Well give us feedback on how he does

Hope this helped

As well goodluck on both of your training!

Hey Natural,
 
Have you experienced the same effectiveness doing this two days a week instead of three?  I find the two day a week to be very attractive if I can get the same (or comparable) results. 
 
I have been doing three for a long time... but I've got a terrible schedule for my days (have to work out at 5 am everyday).

Started scrawny...

1/1/2006... 5'8" at 130 lbs

4/13/2006... 5'8" at 151 lbs

Progress is being made!

ORIGINAL: Murrdog

Hey Natural,

Have you experienced the same effectiveness doing this two days a week instead of three?  I find the two day a week to be very attractive if I can get the same (or comparable) results. 

I have been doing three for a long time... but I've got a terrible schedule for my days (have to work out at 5 am everyday).

Hey what's up sir,

My apologies if I didn't reply right away, been busy with work, and spending time with my girlfriend.

Well 2 day schedules are good if you have hectic schedules and as well it's alright if you miss a day or 2 when doing 2 day split simply because on 2 day split your going to have to have at least 2-3 day rest in between before goin on next workout.

As well doesn't make a diffrence my friend, on bulking routine 2-3 day splits are the best, simply because you train less for sucess and not only I wanted to do 2 day split because I'm busy but I'm slow recoverer, I sometimes take up to 72-96 hours before going into the next workout.

So just cause muscle soreness is all gone doesn't mean your fully recuperated, you have to listen to yourbody that day see if it's as well ready to hit the weights, also 2 day split are good for people who recover slow such as I and 3 day splits are good for guys who don't have hectice shedules and have fast recovery within 24-48 hrs.

You will get the results my friend there isn't a  diffrence between 2-3day splits theres only a diffrence with guys who train and guys who train hard, you just want to make sure you rest more within the week for muscles to grow and recover an some people recover fast or slow and some people are busy and some are not that's why 2-3day splits benefit as well.

So for an example if you were doing 2 day split, you can workout1 on thursday morning and workout 2 sunday morning, or say workout 1 monday morning and workout 2 friday morning, or workout1 tuesday morning and workout 2 saturday morning or wednesday workout1 and saturday workout2.

Just have 2-3days rest in between when doing 2 day split.

Hope this help sir

Goodluck with training!

Thanks a lot!
 
And don't worry about the sir's.  I appreciate your manners, but I'm a believer that on these forums... we're all the same age.  But I appreciate it!  But I won't be offended otherwise.
 
Thanks for the post though.  I am definitely into the Tuesday and Saturday.  And I am going to train HARD during those times!!! 
 
And don't worry about the fast or slow responses... I'm the kind that post... go back to the main board and read around, then do other things and check back later. 
 
I appreciate all the advice from you and GLD1.  Tomorrow is my first official day on this.  And I really need it.  I feel like I got smaller this past week for some reason.  Then again, I wasn't downing protein all day and didn't work out. 
 
Hey... what's your views on supplements with this plan?  I am not one for supplements, my opinion is that they are like your appendix... it doesn't hurt to have it, but you don't need it to survive.  So I don't take them.  Plus, I don't want to take something I will have to take forever... like creatine.  I hear that when you stop using it, you lose most of the effects. 
 
But I do use protein.  I try my hardest to get around 1g per pound of weight.  Pretty much my meals plus two shakes a day. 
 
Is this good enough for this work out or should I change that portion of my diet?  I know the addage eat big to get big... but I didn't take much protein over the last week (since I wasn't working out) so I feel like I lost all I did before.  Probably all in the head!

Started scrawny...

1/1/2006... 5'8" at 130 lbs

4/13/2006... 5'8" at 151 lbs

Progress is being made!

ORIGINAL: Murrdog

Thanks a lot!

And don't worry about the sir's.  I appreciate your manners, but I'm a believer that on these forums... we're all the same age.  But I appreciate it!  But I won't be offended otherwise.

Thanks for the post though.  I am definitely into the Tuesday and Saturday.  And I am going to train HARD during those times!!! 

And don't worry about the fast or slow responses... I'm the kind that post... go back to the main board and read around, then do other things and check back later. 

I appreciate all the advice from you and GLD1.  Tomorrow is my first official day on this.  And I really need it.  I feel like I got smaller this past week for some reason.  Then again, I wasn't downing protein all day and didn't work out. 

Hey... what's your views on supplements with this plan?  I am not one for supplements, my opinion is that they are like your appendix... it doesn't hurt to have it, but you don't need it to survive.  So I don't take them.  Plus, I don't want to take something I will have to take forever... like creatine.  I hear that when you stop using it, you lose most of the effects. 

But I do use protein.  I try my hardest to get around 1g per pound of weight.  Pretty much my meals plus two shakes a day. 

Is this good enough for this work out or should I change that portion of my diet?  I know the addage eat big to get big... but I didn't take much protein over the last week (since I wasn't working out) so I feel like I lost all I did before.  Probably all in the head!

 
Murrdog:
 
Not a problem bud anytime.
 
It’s good your going to start the routine tomorrow, just be sure to have good night sleep before doing this.
 
Also don’t worry about getting smaller, cause your not, I’m sure has to do with you not feeling sore at all since also is  the  past week were your taking that week off. But anyway your not getting smaller unless you’ve stop working out for months and starved yourself, then you should worry.
 
Towards supplements I’m not a fan since also I don’t take them but as well been told and I don't believe a protein supplement is necessary for the natural trainer in a bulking phase. It's much better to get your protein from food plus you need the extra calories. In a cutting phase, when calorie restriction is important, a protein supplement is necessary.But if your considering supps then I suggest whey should be fine.
 
Towards diet you want to eat around 5-6 meals a day, and at each meal eat protein,carb, fruit or vegetable, and It's much better to get your protein from food, Make sure your carbs are low on the glycemic index, and avoid simple carbs, sugar and One cheat meal a week is fine if you can’t really handle the diet.
 
Hope this help
 
Goodluck with training!
 
 

Murrdog...
 
This thread here will have all your nutritional questions answered.
 
With regards to creatine...When you stop taking it you do not lose the effects. You will suffer a slight loss in strength, and a loss of size. This is because creatine retains water in your muscles to aid protein synthesis.
 
Naturally when this water retention is lost the size will shrink. You will however recover your strength relatively quickly as you continue to train. If you do take creatine make sure you are well hydrated all the time...
 
As far as protein goes, i take a supplement. Whey is perfect for this. I take it at around mid morning and then immediately after my workout. My diet however sucks, and as i have posted in another thread i will be drastically improving this starting next week...
 
I haven't the time to prepare food as i am constantly on the go with one thing or another, so i feel that a protein supplement is a good way to save time.
 
A few things you have mentioned...
 
Training at 5 am seems a little drastic. Does this mean you lose sleep? You need to get around 8 hours sleep a night to aid recovery. You also need energy to lift weights and i am concerned that lifting at 5 am on this type of programme will be ineffective as you will not have enough energy stored up. This could all be pie in the sky though as i do not know your schedule haha...
 
I would greatly advise you however to take the time to work out your diet as meticulously as possible to get the best possible gains. Supps can help this but are not essential, my $0.02c

11.04.06:
Age: 22
Weight: 211 Lbs - 96 KG
Height: 6'
Body Fat: 22.13%

I LOVE LEG DAY!!

I think if it is possible Murrdog that you should train in the evening time, but it is really up to your daily shedule.

By evening you should have higher glycogen levels in your body, meaning more fuel to push those heavy weights via the food you have eaten throuout the day.

And oppositely you should do areobics in the morning as glycogen levels are low and you are more easily able to target fat instead of carbohydrate for energy. (That is if your planning to lose some fat) But anyway areobic exercise is still somewhat important.

Age: 20

Height: 5ft 10in

Weght 156
Vegetarian

Critque my Physique

Thanks all three of you (Natural, GLD1, & Death).  I really appreciate all of your advice.
 
I have gotten myself into a practice of two protein shakes a day... so I guess it doesn't hurt to keep trying.  I will think over the creatine.  I have been told by way too many people that it works.  I'll see how things go for the first month and see if I think it may be needed.
 
As far as working out first thing in the morning... I am a member of the YMCA in Charlotte, NC.  I am an accountant so I'm an 8-5 workday, and I have tried to go after work, but the parking lot is completely full at all the locations as it is the place to see and be seen around here.   So when I go in, I have to wait for benches, dumbells... basically EVERYTHING.  And I'm a motivated one (9 years of military school will do that) so I can't stop to wait... and going back to the military school stuff... it has taught me to be a morning person!!!  You know the military saying... we do more before 8 am than most people do all day.  So I would say that my most energetic time of the day is when I wake up.  But I get plenty of sleep.  8-9 hours.  I really wish I could do it in the evenings after work but those places are just so packed.  At 5 am, there's only about 8 people or so working out, so you have free reign.  And I have really enjoyed working out with the 5 am crew.  I get my complete work out by 6 am, get ready for the day... and drive on.
 
I hope that it doesn't hurt me too much to do it in the morning.  I make sure I get a good breakfast in before I go (around 4:30).  Now this is just my weekday work out... my Saturday work out is done around Noon. 
 
And this was my first day and I thought I'd let you all know... I loved it.  Just three exercises, 5 sets of 5 a piece... and I loved it.  I felt like I got a better work out with just 15 sets, than I have trying to do those Iso's and stuff.  I can see myself really enjoying this one for long haul (12 weeks until taking a week, then maybe mixing it up a little).
 
And if you remember, I had never done dead's or squats and today was Pull for me, so I did dead's first thing.  I started off with a lighter weight, then I found myself comfortable at 185... comfortable being just enough to do 5 reps.  But after I was done with the 5 sets of deads, I can see now exactly what I was missing in my plan... a lower back work out.  That really did make a difference.  And I can't wait to do some squats on my Push day.
 
185 sound like a good place to start on deads?  I also found a huge increas in my rowing.  I was doing 55lbs for each side in my row's before... today I was doing 85 lbs per arm!!!  I think the week off really helped... and the fact that I only had one exercise done before it (the deads) I was able to really rip it out on the rowing.  My barbell curls also increased from 45 lbs to 55 lbs. 
 
I think the best part of this work out is that I haven't over done my muscle groups before I get to these exercises.  Rows were usually done later in my work out, so my arms and back were already tiring. 
 
And with the deads... I really liked it.  I didn't think I would.  But not long after I finished (just a few minutes) I felt pain in my lower back... GOOD pain though!  Like those muscles were saying "Hey Murrdog... thanks for finally noticing us down here!!"  It was a good pain like they were finally being worked.  Not back pain sore... muscle work out sore.  Good stuff!
 
Natural... thanks for posting this.  I am singing praises after just one work out... and I think I'll probably do more! 
 
Also, gained two pounds this past off week... at 153 now!  (I'm sure that there's a little fat on that too). 
 
Some time today I am going to start a journal on the other board to track progress.  I'm glad I found this thread.
 
For those other people reading this thread that are considering this plan... try it out, at least for a week.  Especially people like me that are still in the rookie/beginner stage.  I'm only 3-4 months into working out for the first time, and I wish I would have tried this first.

Started scrawny...

1/1/2006... 5'8" at 130 lbs

4/13/2006... 5'8" at 151 lbs

Progress is being made!

Murrdog:
 
I’m very glad to hear you’ve started this routine and really enjoyed it. Your actually making me feel like working out today, but I  can’t it’s my week off.
 
And yes it is good you took that week off, taking a week off after battering your muscles with weights is a good idea and not also gives you rest but as well gets you stronger.
 
It’s good you got your lower back muscles working and noticed bud, for it’s very important and as well your are doing it correctly, and that’s good.
 
For deads, don’t sweat it , 185 isn’t bad at all to start, doesn’t matter were you start off, just aslong you don’t start off with everything you got for last set and finishof 5 reps when it’s your first time doing this routine, it’s better to gradually build up momentum and from there you will be challenge more and more and along the way be amazed of success and hard work you put in.
 
And not problem, just here to help. I wish I would have know this later on as well. Start a journal for your progress. It’s a good idea as well to keep track of your weights.
 
Murrdog, just be sure and I guarantee you, you should be sore and as well wait for 2-3 days before going to workout2, you should  feel strong going to your next workout. So don’t forget to eat and rest alright bud.
 
Goodluck with training and keep at it!

Yeah, I'm sure that once I get to know the dead lift a few more times, I can bump up that weight.  Good place to start though considering I've never done it before and those muscles are probably a little weak.
 
Natural, I am wanting to trim a little of the body fat (my gut) and I know the best way is cardio.  Do you do any cardio during this program?  I am trying to bulk... but all I'm doing is bulking under the fat.  Would running for two or three mornings between the work outs hurt?  I don't want to slow progress... but want to at least not look like a weeble-wobble (thin top and bottom, but gut in the middle)

Started scrawny...

1/1/2006... 5'8" at 130 lbs

4/13/2006... 5'8" at 151 lbs

Progress is being made!

i too will start this program and see the results in this week... i just started yesterday... i did what you planned... lower back and biceps and just like murdog said you're right i'm lacking the "BACKBONE" of my lower back... i mean i started really low because i do have some cases of low back pains so i wanted to start off with 20 lbs and only did 10 reps of em and yes i feel some muscle and i usually sleep pretty bad because of my low back pains but now i feel good... i love this training outline and its only 3 times a week! i usually did 6 times a week and i never see any gains... but for now i'll see where this plan goes hopefully it'll be good... thx purenatural for the plan outlines and what we need to do to see the gains i hope so see... right now i'm only 120lbs 5'8 we'll see where i stand by the end of the week i'll send you my updates LATE