Massbuilding - *MB Part II pg. 16*

do either dumbbell bench press, shoulder press, incline bench press or substitute incline with dips

"if you like animals with cages, then you must be gay"

lol no offence but i seriously don't get what you're trying to say.

Do

flat Bench press
shoulder press
dips

or

flat bench press
shoulder press
incline bench press

"if you like animals with cages, then you must be gay"

ok thanks for the reply. but something i wanna ask again is, 5x5 how much weight should i actually choose to do it with? ( since replies are that i shouldn't perform all to failure )
should i find a weight that i can do up to 6 rep max? so i can do 5 and have 1 more rep in my pocket.
doing 5lbs 5 reps and 20 lbs 5 reps can still be 5X5( 5 sets, 5 reps) but of cus the muscle growth generated will be different? so yea, how do i choose the weights for 5x5?

choose a weight that you can easily manage for 5x5 then add 5 pounds each week

"if you like animals with cages, then you must be gay"

Awesome post PureNatural.  I will be starting this up on Monday.  Thanks a lot man. 

"Quotes are nothing but inspiration for the uninspired."
-Richard Kemph

PureNatural, this is my second week of training.

I've been doing great for the PUSH routine.

But, I have problems doing the PULL routine.
Concerning it is only my second week, I have problems putting more weight on the deadlift, I can't manage to grip the bar any harder. Can I use one palm facing up, one palm facing down, for better grip, or should I just stay with the conventional grip, with current weight next week?

Thanks.

5'8.1"
Age = 20 
started in February 16th 2007: 58kg (127.6lbs)
current : around 79-80kg (173.8lb-176lb)

IMO the weight is too heavy try dropping it to 10-15 pounds and work your way back up again.
 
If your not concerned with either developing a strong grip or somewhat size on your forearms then use under/over hand grip.
 
I personally would stick with double overhand if you plan on wanting to add poundages to your deadlifts. Stick with em until you plateau or about a cycle or 2 then switch to over/under, it will feel as you can hold on to anything

"if you like animals with cages, then you must be gay"

ORIGINAL: PureNatural

IMO the weight is too heavy try dropping it to 10-15 pounds and work your way back up again.

If your not concerned with either developing a strong grip or somewhat size on your forearms then use under/over hand grip.

I personally would stick with double overhand if you plan on wanting to add poundages to your deadlifts. Stick with em until you plateau or about a cycle or 2 then switch to over/under, it will feel as you can hold on to anything

I always want to use the double overhand grip, because I want to increase my grip and my forearms too. So, do you suggest me to drop some weights, then increase them again gradually?

5'8.1"
Age = 20 
started in February 16th 2007: 58kg (127.6lbs)
current : around 79-80kg (173.8lb-176lb)

ORIGINAL: PureNatural
try dropping it to 10-15 pounds and work your way back up again.

"if you like animals with cages, then you must be gay"

Hi,
 
I like the look of this program, however I have one question.  Could the deadlift be replaced with another execrcise. Every time I try the deadlift and/or SLDL it starts out OK but I end up screwing up my form... and eventually get close to hurting myself.
 
thank you in advance for your reply

I would try using a light weight, and practicing your form until you have it down.  Don't jump in there with heavy weights on an exercise you are not comfortable with. 

ORIGINAL: hemmi

Hi,

I like the look of this program, however I have one question.  Could the deadlift be replaced with another execrcise. Every time I try the deadlift and/or SLDL it starts out OK but I end up screwing up my form... and eventually get close to hurting myself.

thank you in advance for your reply

You have to work the deadlifts. It's an incredible mass exercise. Start with the bar without the weights, and do proper form, just to get the "mind and muscle connection", so that you could perform the perfect form. Ask somebody in the gym that knows the perfect form.

5'8.1"
Age = 20 
started in February 16th 2007: 58kg (127.6lbs)
current : around 79-80kg (173.8lb-176lb)

hey ok now i'm back into trying this program! had no choice but to shelve it aside as i was having exams>.<
regarding the adding on of 5 pnds a week, for excersizes that requires the use of dumbbells, i can't. the gym (public) only have certain fixed mass of dumbbells, and the next possible one is like way too far off. a 14kg dumbbell, and a consecutive 20kg dumbbell.
i do know that i can substitute dumbbell excersizes to barbell ones, say dumbbell chest presses to bench. but i'd prefer not to do bench because i dun have a spotter!(the bell fell on me once)most of my frens are not as dedicated to gyming as i am.
any possible solutions?
 
just a random question to add on, when everyone TALKs about how much they bench are they including the weight of the bar? my bench is quite pathetic for my current weight of 161lbs.

Who cares about how much you can bench. If I were to tell you how much I could bench, you'd laugh. Anyways, it seems that you're doing bench press to failure? Avoid doing it to failure, and that way you won't need a spotter.

o ya another thing i wanna ask is..
i heard 1 guy in this forum saying that for 5x5 training, the ideal situation is that we should only be able to complete the last rep of the final set. does this applies to all the excersizes on the same day or just the final one?
in addition what's the rest time in between sets for 5x5? i heard a couple of ppl saying that we should rest till we are MENTALLY n physically prepared. but..if we rest long enough, wouldn't we be able to do more reps for the final set? shouldn't the timing be important since every set (except for the last) isn't suppose to go till failure?

this has been one of the most helpful threads ive read here so far and i just wanted to say thanks to purenatural for posting this.  I have been doing 4-5 day splits for the last 3-4 months and its really taking it toll on me i cant wait to start this 3 days a week.
 
My question is, how long does the workout usualy take you guys on average? i dont like to be in the gym for more then an hour/hour fifteen at most.  And also is the 5x5 more ideal then the 4x6? thanks :)

hey all this workout sounds right up my alley.. i cant wait to start it. I just had like 3 simple questions i was wondering about so ill lay em out..

-Im planning on doing Monday - day 1, Wednesday - day 2, Friday - day 3.. Saturday and Sunday off. Does that give me enough rest time or should i do maybe- Monday,Wednesday, Saturday? no big difference i would hope.

-Second question would it be ok to be on a stack during this routine, like BSN Mass Stack for 8-12 weeks?

-Last question this is a stupid one but im jus makin sure its fine to be drinking protein shakes with this routine? I would have them only on workout days so 3 times a week right after the workout..

K i think thats everythin cant wait to start this routine it sounds awesome

was also wondering if its ok that i switched leg and pull day so mine looks like Day1: Legs Day2: Push Day3: Pull.  doesnt seem like it would matter to me but just checking. thanks

dutchyblunt: As long as you give a day rest, it should be ok. But yea if you can spread them as far, then that'll be better.

falloutboy720: No problems. That's how I structured my mine when I did this routine.

For any of those that have been doing this basic layout for a while. For size (besides enough nutrition, rest ect), it's best to give it variety, by that you can stick with a layout every 4-6 weeks or perhaps change exercise from workout to workout for an example do dumbbell rows this week and barbell rows next week. See which you growth best off. And with balance of intensity you are able to add in another excercise.

Those looking for variations. Here are some.

Also, some of you may find it too taxing, in general and on your lower back, to squat and deadlift in the same week.

week 01 M  Legs (Squat) W Push F pull (Deadlift)

Week 02 M Push W Legs (Squat) F Push

Week 03 M pull (Deadlift) W Push F Legs (Squat)

week 04 M Push W pull (Deadlift) F Push

and so forth...

This variation is also good for those of you who already have good leg development but comparatively less in chest, shoulders, and triceps and the ability to fully recover in 4-5 days instead of 6-7.

As for doing push twice a week, it's best to do different movements. So for an example in workout 1 you did barbell bench, in workout 3 do dumbell bench.

---

Another variation could be by choice, for an example after having a solid base develop if you lack of lat width why not put wide grip chins first or even barbell/dumbbell rows, why not switch up from cycle to cycle

Wide grip chins
Barbell rows
Deads
Curls

Therefore, some body part will lack in development compare to others so it's best to prioritise and give it variety.

---

Some might find deadlifts, squats, military press boring by now. There are always alternatives. You can do dumbbell squats, lunges, hack squats, dumbell deadlifts, power cleans, power snatches, power pulls, clean and press, push press.

You don't always have to do barbell deads and squats or military press/shoulder press.

---

Another variation could be upper lower mixed movements. Those that get bored doing specialized programs can do substitute this type of layout for a cycle or 2.

Monday

Barbell Bench press
Rows
Shoulder press
Close grip chins

Wednesday

Squats
Deadlifts
Calves
Abs

Friday

Barbell rows
Incline barbell bench press
Wide grip chins
Military press

---

Another variation could be full body type of mixed movements.

workout a

Squats
Barbell Bench
Rows
Curls

workout b

Deadlifts
Shoulder press
Chins
Dips

M:a W:b F:a
M:b W:a F:b and so forth

---

For mass, it's best to give it variety and to change things up so you don't get bored and you can stay motivated.

This will as well give you a chance to see which you grow off best.

You can pretty much come up with your own layout, stick with compounds 3-4 exercises, train 2-4 days a week, keep your workouts 45-60 minutes, reps between 4-8, sets between 3-5 therefore 4x4,3x5,3x6,3x8,4x8,5x5,4x6 are all good combinations.

"if you like animals with cages, then you must be gay"

the workout routine says this:
  Incline or Flat Barbell or Dumbbell Bench Press


Is Incline Dumbbell Ok?

Yes that is fine

"if you like animals with cages, then you must be gay"

didnt you create another forum i cant remember the name
 
caged something

ORIGINAL: triggamayn09

didnt you create another forum i cant remember the name

caged something

 
Sk8terboy I don't know what this has to do with this thread but I am not as active and don't have access to the internet like I used too.
 
I've given enough advice to both you and builtdarntough150 on the other forum I would just be repeating myself if you 2 were the only active members

"if you like animals with cages, then you must be gay"

builtdarntough150 is not there never was
 
its me and mvp
 
i thought you were a mod true mods should help us advertise the excellent site of **** dot net
 
being you would be no longer there would you mind resign your mod status over to me :] and mvp so we can really do something for the forum

Ok i just started this routine. It seems good so far but the problem is i just feel like i need to do at least one more exercise a day. By the end of the workout i dont really feel tired or anything and im just itching to stay in the gym and do at least one more exercise

Would this be ok? or would it mess up the whole program?

I was thinking maybe instead of all the 'OR's' in the routine, I could do two of the exercises. Example:

----Exercises In Parantheses I would do

All 5x5

DAY 1 - PULL

(Deadlifts) or Power Cleans
(Wide Grip Chins) Barbell Rows, or Dumbbell Rows
(Barbell Curls), Close Grip Underhand Chins, or
(Hammer Curls)

DAY 2 - PUSH

(Incline Bench Press) or Flat Barbell or Dumbbell Bench Press
(Barbell Shoulder Press) or Dumbbell Shoulder Presses
(Tricep Dips) AND instead of OR
(Close Grip Bench Press)


DAY 3 - LEGS

(Front Squats) or Back Squats
(Barbell Stiff Lef Deadlifts) or Dumbbell Stiff Leg Deadlifts
---(and Add in maybe Lunges?) 5x5
(Calf Raises (3x12)) - only if a seriously lagging bodypart
(Weighted Crunches) AND instead of OR (Weighted Hanging Leg Raises (3x12))


Keep in mind i do feel like i have pretty high endurance for working out. Ive been doing it for about 6 years and i was always one of those idiots who would be in the gym EVERYDAY doing as many workouts as possible thinking i'd get bigger. I realize now thats not the case.

Any feedback would be much appreciated or Suggestions on different exercises To add in, Or To not add anything in at all and stick with the regular program.... Thanks for the help!

ORIGINAL: dutchyblunt

Ok i just started this routine

 
This is why you feel you need to add in another exercise. You just started, so as each week go's by..by adding 5 pound increments it will become more taxing.
 
For now I would just stick with 3 but if you feel you need to add in another exercise. Go ahead.
 
Keep adding poundages to your lifts and 3 exercises will be more then enough. Just keep adding 5 pound increments each week.
 
 
 

"if you like animals with cages, then you must be gay"

Ok ive tried this routine exactly now for 8 weeks exactly how it was posted with a healthy diet. I unfortunately lost weight and my muscles look smaller... anyway just thought i'd post that, More importantly I AM going to keep doing it, only now im going to add in two more exercises to each day, so 5 exercises a day.. this is more what my body has been used to and i think i'll see much more gains.

bump

"if you like animals with cages, then you must be gay"