20-beta-ecdysterone

Look at his nips?.. whats going on with him... Oh maybe its due to the fact that his estrogen receptors are acting up.. Holy cow... Did you know that this is a major problem from using pro hormones and steroids at a young age.. ?  I mean this guy obviously isnt under 21 but the odds of you getting this problem is higher then him.

[image]local://12258/DCB9007EC0E146498B7CA53EC5DD12C6.jpg[/image]

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Uh oh now its not just his estrogen receptors acting up But his test levels have come to a hault!! damn!! this guy is going to spend another couple years trying to get back the muscle he lost!  think about how hard it is for a woman to gain muscle?  When you guys are in your mid 20's you can look like this and its going to be even harder to gain muscle then it is now...  

[image]local://12258/6D033490934C4234A7D9B629C4304C57.jpg[/image]

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Fact : This man probably took very large doses of anabolic steroids.
 
Fact: More and more people under the age of 21 have had this guys problem without even taking that much pro hormones or anabolic steroids.
 
  Okay im done
 

i hate people that just shoot down products before even knowing anything about them. yes i agree that diet+training can beat supps any day of the week. however, supps are there to do what they are meant to do SUPPLEMENT your workout to give you an extra boost. e-bol could be the next big thing or it could absolutely suck, but you will never know until you try it. if you try e-bol and it sucked for you then you could criticize it all day, but don't criticize stuff that you haven't even taken yourself.

ORIGINAL: rippedkid101

i hate people that just shoot down products before even knowing anything about them. yes i agree that diet+training can beat supps any day of the week. however, supps are there to do what they are meant to do SUPPLEMENT your workout to give you an extra boost. e-bol could be the next big thing or it could absolutely suck, but you will never know until you try it. if you try e-bol and it sucked for you then you could criticize it all day, but don't criticize stuff that you haven't even taken yourself.

  I would personally rather wait for somebody else to take it and prove it works with no side effects before I give it a try. In other words I don't want to buy a product to be a test rat.

  I stick with creatine and have recently started thinking about takeing MRI's No2 because I've heard so many good things about it; and I work at GNC and not one person has returned it since I've been there. It's amazing how many people return these products unsatisfied though: Isa-test, testosorogrow2, super test, vitrix, X-test, other products that end with bol(epecially fizogen). two prodcuts that nobody has ever returned MRI's CE2 and NO2 infact everyone that I ask about them says they love it.

   Anyway back to e-bol. Yes ti would be the best ecdysterone product out there being it is the only one that actually has a considerable amount in it. The rest of them have a much lower percent of ecdysterone in them.

If it wasn't painfully difficult then you didn't do it right

age:18
5' 81/2"
173 lbs
goal : 195


supplements: Multi, fish oil

ORIGINAL: rippedkid101

i hate people that just shoot down products before even knowing anything about them. yes i agree that diet+training can beat supps any day of the week. however, supps are there to do what they are meant to do SUPPLEMENT your workout to give you an extra boost. e-bol could be the next big thing or it could absolutely suck, but you will never know until you try it. if you try e-bol and it sucked for you then you could criticize it all day, but don't criticize stuff that you haven't even taken yourself.

Don't you think you might just be a supplement's marketing firm's wet dream with that attitude?

On the other hand, you don't know if an untested supplement (even anecdotely - sp) would interfere with your training....so then, is it worth the risk?

"If there's nothing else that's relevant, I'll be leaving now"

"Today's mighty oak is just yesterday's nut that held its ground"

ORIGINAL: IBendBarbells

Fact : This man probably took very large doses of anabolic steroids.

Fact: More and more people under the age of 21 have had this guys problem without even taking that much pro hormones or anabolic steroids.

  Okay im done

Where'd you get all those pics? Scary!

"If there's nothing else that's relevant, I'll be leaving now"

"Today's mighty oak is just yesterday's nut that held its ground"

ORIGINAL: IBendBarbells

Fact : This man probably took very large doses of anabolic steroids.

Fact: More and more people under the age of 21 have had this guys problem without even taking that much pro hormones or anabolic steroids.

  Okay im done

 
What does this thread have to do with anabolic steroids?
ecdysterone is a plant/insect steroid but it's non hormonal in humans, the whole point is it's a much safer alternative. In terms of results in no where close to steroids.
I'm trying to find some research done on it, I know there were animal studies done.
 

Bottom line:
 
You should use whatever research that is available to you to draw conclusions about a particular supplement.
 
Most people spend a fair amount of time on home loans, new cars, vacations, airline tickets, snowboarding stuff, etc.
 
Why should supplements be any different?

Marc C. David - NGA CPT
Author of NoBull Bodybuilding
www.nobullbodybuilding.com

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Okay I went a tiny bit off subject I was just trying to point out that you guys keep looking for the easy way to gain... or the easy way to get big fast... By using pro hormones steroids or legal herb sups that really dont do anything at all..

I mean honestly guys if most people only gain 5 - 10 lbs of muscle with their 65 - 70$ that they spent on superdrol whats the point in that?
 
If you only gain 10 - 15lbs of muscle from dianabol by spending 100 $ in a month and lose the most of it anyways where is the point in that?
 
You guys are going to spend like what 40 - 50$ on this garbage and how much do you really expect to gain ?  2lbs?  Why not just go to the store and spend the money on food?
 
It just seems like a waste of money too me...  And the picture of the guy wasnt totally accurate he was getting surgery for his gyno problems contributed by the use of anabolics.  I was just using him as an example.
 

supps are there to do what they are meant to do SUPPLEMENT your workout to give you an extra boost.

 
SUPPLEMENT means EXTRA....
 
Supplements are not a solution.
 

 e-bol could be the next big thing or it could absolutely suck, but you will never know until you try it. if you try e-bol and it sucked for you then you could criticize it all day, but don't criticize stuff that you haven't even taken yourself.

No, what is appropriate is to criticise a product based on evidence.  That would generally be data from repeated tests.  Then you will knoe what it does, in what dose, at what frequency, what the total effects are (desired and "collateral"), duration of use...
 
These clinical tests are to determine many things for us...safety being only one.
 
Not your own assumptions about what it may or may not have done.

My Journal Gain Muscle - http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/fb.ashx?m=111173 Lose Fat - http://www.discussbodybuilding.com/fb.ashx?m=111175

I totally agree that everyone should research the supplements they buy throughly. I usually do that with most things so I don't end up throwing my money away.
 

ORIGINAL: IBendBarbells

Okay I went a tiny bit off subject I was just trying to point out that you guys keep looking for the easy way to gain... or the easy way to get big fast... By using pro hormones steroids or legal herb sups that really dont do anything at all..

I mean honestly guys if most people only gain 5 - 10 lbs of muscle with their 65 - 70$ that they spent on superdrol whats the point in that?
 
If you only gain 10 - 15lbs of muscle from dianabol by spending 100 $ in a month and lose the most of it anyways where is the point in that?
 
You guys are going to spend like what 40 - 50$ on this garbage and how much do you really expect to gain ?  2lbs?  Why not just go to the store and spend the money on food?
 
It just seems like a waste of money too me...  And the picture of the guy wasnt totally accurate he was getting surgery for his gyno problems contributed by the use of anabolics.  I was just using him as an example.
 

 
Hey an extra 2lbs of muscle per month plus maybe increased vascularity/intensity? Sure that's worth well it.
Cheaper then that bottle of NO2 I bought.  
I don't have unrealistic expectations.
 
You can run a superdol cycle for 70 bucks? I figured it'd be way more then that with pct and everything.
 
I really don't know about ecdysterone but I want to keep an open mind because there are always overhyped supplements that do nothing but then again there are some that deliver and it's hard to see throught the marketing.
 
Well here's what I could find so far:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt=AbstractPlus&list_uids=3234543&query_hl=3&itool=pubmed_DocSum
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt=AbstractPlus&list_uids=9505354&query_hl=3&itool=pubmed_docsum

I didnt include the PCT in that price range. 
 
you do know the most effective PCT is also illegal too right?  Some can even cause you to lose your vision.. whats the point in gaining the muscle if you cant see your self in the mirror ...  Its all pretty risky stuff ya know? 
 
 

Well here's what I could find so far: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt=AbstractPlus&list_uids=3234543&query_hl=3&itool=pubmed_DocSum http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt=AbstractPlus&list_uids=9505354&query_hl=3&itool=pubmed_docsum
_____________________________

Not the most promising references...

"If there's nothing else that's relevant, I'll be leaving now"

"Today's mighty oak is just yesterday's nut that held its ground"